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Message: <blockquote data-quote="hawkeyefan" data-source="post: 6980620" data-attributes="member: 6785785">If they don't notice the shift, I would think that they aren't experiencing any problem...so in such a case, there's nothing to fix.I can understand the criticism. I can see how for some this may be a problem. However, I think we are discussing it in different ways, more than having a different discussion. I think this is where our disconnect is. For my game, the idea of building optimal characters as you describe them would be a step backward. My players and I have been through the power-gaming/optimizing phase, and we've come out the other side....it's not as big a goal for us anymore. That does not mean that they don't create effective characters. It just means that they approach it differently. My players aren't going to create a party where everyone has darkvision and everyone has dipped into fighter or warlock just for a couple of class abilities. They aren't all going to specialize in ranged combat. They don't seek to distill the game down to the most effective mechanical combination and then simply reproduce that every campaign. I think this is probably true for more games than you seem to realize. Whether it's because the players are as mindful of the game or it's because they're new players who haven't yet learned to create such mechanical combinations yet. Well, no, it's not. For the reasons above, mainly....but also because there are other ways to address the issue, as I have expressed in prior posts. Limiting range, varying enemy types and numbers, terrain and other environmental factors....all of that stuff is a first step to controlling any imbalance between the two approaches to combat. Yes, I acknowledge that for some it may not be enough....but for many it will be. I did also make one point that you never replied to; you said that absolutely nothing was lost when character uses ranged attacks rather than melee and I mentioned opportunity attacks. I'm curious for your take on that. Do you acknowledge that's an advantage of melee over ranged? Or do you not think that is an important role in the game? Understood. My point is that this is simply your opinion of how things play out at your table. Others will share this opinion. For those who do, I agree that changes are in order. I think there are simple things that could be done to help the issue. However, if those do not work, then sure, more severe options should be considered. I don't think this issue is widespread enough to demand the type of attention you think it deserves.</blockquote>

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