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<blockquote data-quote="feartheminotaur" data-source="post: 6825676" data-attributes="member: 6801354">Please.&nbsp; This is most certainly a criticism.&nbsp; Typing that it isn't doesn't negate using &quot;two-dimensional characters&quot; in the pejorative sense (and &quot;murderhobos&quot; is nothing but) or saying things like &quot;I feel sorry for you&quot;.&nbsp; You've made it clear you don't think some players are playing 'the right way' and your disdain for those that don't is pretty clear (e.g., the Diablo crack).&nbsp; Condescension and &quot;I pity the way you play&quot; ARE criticisms.&nbsp; Players (and DMs) that enjoy murderhobo games, or any variation that's a 'dealbreaker' for you, don't need you to set them free.&nbsp; Not everyone needs to be, or should be, persuaded to your way of thinking (all of your responses boil down to &quot;here's how to play better and/or correctly&quot;).&nbsp; And I'm not sure why anyone would feel the need to convince someone what they want is wrong.What they need is an understanding from the beginning what the rewards, in-game, for playing are going to be.&nbsp; Hey, maybe the players want a free-form game and the DM isn't capable/willing to oblige (It goes both ways.&nbsp; How many thousands of threads have there been about &quot;OP PCs&quot; because they creatively used their in-game rewards a way the DM didn't like?).&nbsp; If @<a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/member.php?u=6804148" target="_blank">TheLoneRanger1979</a> sits down at a table and says &quot;I don't care about keeps or titles, I want to play a game where I can buy magic items&quot; and the DM says &quot;No, you can't buy magic items.&nbsp; You're going to get gold you can use to buy keeps or titles because I find it exciting&quot;, neither style is wrong, nor is one superior to other.&nbsp; What it is is the beginning of a soon to be posted &quot;Bad DM/Problem Player&quot; thread.&nbsp; Rewards and game style are the kind of details that should be discussed up front, session zero.&nbsp; If the way the majority wants to play is not your thing, you don't need to &quot;kinda feel bad&quot; for anyone or make snide little put downs like &quot;tower of might +1&quot;, you just need to walk away from a game you won't enjoy and let them enjoy the game they want to play.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="feartheminotaur, post: 6825676, member: 6801354"] Please. This is most certainly a criticism. Typing that it isn't doesn't negate using "two-dimensional characters" in the pejorative sense (and "murderhobos" is nothing but) or saying things like "I feel sorry for you". You've made it clear you don't think some players are playing 'the right way' and your disdain for those that don't is pretty clear (e.g., the Diablo crack). Condescension and "I pity the way you play" ARE criticisms. Players (and DMs) that enjoy murderhobo games, or any variation that's a 'dealbreaker' for you, don't need you to set them free. Not everyone needs to be, or should be, persuaded to your way of thinking (all of your responses boil down to "here's how to play better and/or correctly"). And I'm not sure why anyone would feel the need to convince someone what they want is wrong. What they need is an understanding from the beginning what the rewards, in-game, for playing are going to be. Hey, maybe the players want a free-form game and the DM isn't capable/willing to oblige (It goes both ways. How many thousands of threads have there been about "OP PCs" because they creatively used their in-game rewards a way the DM didn't like?). If @[I][B][U][URL="http://www.enworld.org/forum/member.php?u=6804148"]TheLoneRanger1979[/URL][/U][/B][/I] sits down at a table and says "I don't care about keeps or titles, I want to play a game where I can buy magic items" and the DM says "No, you can't buy magic items. You're going to get gold you can use to buy keeps or titles because I find it exciting", neither style is wrong, nor is one superior to other. What it is is the beginning of a soon to be posted "Bad DM/Problem Player" thread. Rewards and game style are the kind of details that should be discussed up front, session zero. If the way the majority wants to play is not your thing, you don't need to "kinda feel bad" for anyone or make snide little put downs like "tower of might +1", you just need to walk away from a game you won't enjoy and let them enjoy the game [I]they [/I]want to play. [/QUOTE]

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