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"He's beyond my healing ability..."
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<blockquote data-quote="Rassilon" data-source="post: 5616545" data-attributes="member: 15065"><p><strong>Colour me heretical</strong></p><p></p><p>I do this - or something like this - <em>ALL THE TIME</em>!</p><p></p><p>In the last few sessions I'm pretty sure I've done the dying last words; I've definitely done dramatic monologue that couldn't be interrupted; I've emailed a "cinematic cutscene" of the baddies having a meeting that was for the players to build their anticipation, not for the PCs to react to using any sort of mechanics test or check; and after directing everyone to make a spot check I've said "you spot a big arrow pointing to the secret door that you haven't checked for because you pacified this room last session and forgot that you meant to search it this session." Oh I almost forgot! I've also made 'choo choo' noises when my guys strayed too far from the plot. </p><p></p><p>As with almost everything that generates a long thread (aside from RAW arguments ; ) I find that basically this boils down to 'different strokes for different folks'. And it's very interesting <em>why</em> these are the particular strokes for folks... </p><p></p><p>There’s an example upthread where because the healing has failed, the PCs need to ask ‘why’ it failed given they – and the players – know it should work. This to me highlights two obvious levers to adjust regarding predictability / reliability / gamistry, and drama / emotion / narrative.</p><p></p><p>The first is the extent to which the game world relies on the mechanics the players use to [run their characters and interact with the world] to construct and justify itself;</p><p>The second is the extent to which the DM tells the [players] when they are participating as [players] or as [characters].</p><p></p><p>So you can have a game that attempts to explain – or at least admit there is an explanation to be derived – for basically everything in the world based on the mechanics in the books, and not in conflict with things that would seem to be specified mechanically. You can go the other way and maintain that mechanics are just for the PCs, and have little to do with the world qua the world; and there is of course a range in between, where most of us play. </p><p></p><p>On the other lever, how much is the DM involving the players in shared stewardship of the game outside the actual gaming? For example: the DM who does what I did above and tells everyone that there’s a secret door that was missed and where it was - he has chosen to involve his <em>players</em> very much in the stewardship of the game outside the gaming. The DM who either never reveals the secret door, or makes sure the characters/players find out about it ensuring the players never realise that they missed it and the DM “cheated” on their behalf - has chosen to involve his players less. <strong>Everything this DM tells, he tells to the characters, not the players</strong>.</p><p></p><p>To be very clear: all of this, any combination, or intensity, or variation, is just fabulous as long as it works for the group.</p><p></p><p>The first lever tells players to what extent they should look for differences from expected mechanical outcomes as clues; the second the extent to which the DM can easily tell the players that ‘this is an exception’.</p><p></p><p>So: if a DM runs a world where the (broad) physics are specified by the game mechanics, and only tells the characters things, not the players, that DM can never do the dying last words purely for dramatic convenience, or homage, or any 'out of game' reason. Because the physics for the world have been set, and <u>cure light wounds causes the process of dying to cease</u>. That <em>would </em> be confusing his players if he did that. Maybe they <em>would</em> wonder about some of the other calls. That DM must always have an in game explanation, mechanically justifiable too, for why the cure light wounds didn’t work. And to be worthy of screen time it probably should be part of the story. And it should be possible for the characters to find out why, though they might never actually do so.</p><p></p><p>I’ve run and played in games where the levers have been set at various ends of the spectrum, especially the character vs. player perception of the world one. The current game is probably the most self aware. At times it seems the characters almost seem to be unconsciously aware that they are characters in d&d. Almost. </p><p></p><p>We (my gaming group) have chosen the ‘order of the stick’ approach deliberately. It is actually really fun. It is light hearted too, which is important when everyone is tired and real life is a bit rough. And most of all, it cuts out – at the cost of some story lines and experiences – a lot of “realistic” dead time. My little team basically doesn’t have time to game. We are lucky to have 12 sessions a year. Everyone has made it very clear that right at the moment we don’t have time to have an immersive, simulationist experience if that means we spend a whole session following up the wrong leads, not advancing the story, not killing things, and taking their stuff. And it's fun!</p><p></p><p>In the future, when the situation is different, we’ll adjust the levers again, and play differently. That will be great too.</p><p></p><p>- Rassilon</p><p></p><p>(ps: sorry about the long post)</p><p>(pps: not so sorry that I didn’t still post it)</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Rassilon, post: 5616545, member: 15065"] [b]Colour me heretical[/b] I do this - or something like this - [I]ALL THE TIME[/I]! In the last few sessions I'm pretty sure I've done the dying last words; I've definitely done dramatic monologue that couldn't be interrupted; I've emailed a "cinematic cutscene" of the baddies having a meeting that was for the players to build their anticipation, not for the PCs to react to using any sort of mechanics test or check; and after directing everyone to make a spot check I've said "you spot a big arrow pointing to the secret door that you haven't checked for because you pacified this room last session and forgot that you meant to search it this session." Oh I almost forgot! I've also made 'choo choo' noises when my guys strayed too far from the plot. As with almost everything that generates a long thread (aside from RAW arguments ; ) I find that basically this boils down to 'different strokes for different folks'. And it's very interesting [I]why[/I] these are the particular strokes for folks... There’s an example upthread where because the healing has failed, the PCs need to ask ‘why’ it failed given they – and the players – know it should work. This to me highlights two obvious levers to adjust regarding predictability / reliability / gamistry, and drama / emotion / narrative. The first is the extent to which the game world relies on the mechanics the players use to [run their characters and interact with the world] to construct and justify itself; The second is the extent to which the DM tells the [players] when they are participating as [players] or as [characters]. So you can have a game that attempts to explain – or at least admit there is an explanation to be derived – for basically everything in the world based on the mechanics in the books, and not in conflict with things that would seem to be specified mechanically. You can go the other way and maintain that mechanics are just for the PCs, and have little to do with the world qua the world; and there is of course a range in between, where most of us play. On the other lever, how much is the DM involving the players in shared stewardship of the game outside the actual gaming? For example: the DM who does what I did above and tells everyone that there’s a secret door that was missed and where it was - he has chosen to involve his [I]players[/I] very much in the stewardship of the game outside the gaming. The DM who either never reveals the secret door, or makes sure the characters/players find out about it ensuring the players never realise that they missed it and the DM “cheated” on their behalf - has chosen to involve his players less. [B]Everything this DM tells, he tells to the characters, not the players[/B]. To be very clear: all of this, any combination, or intensity, or variation, is just fabulous as long as it works for the group. The first lever tells players to what extent they should look for differences from expected mechanical outcomes as clues; the second the extent to which the DM can easily tell the players that ‘this is an exception’. So: if a DM runs a world where the (broad) physics are specified by the game mechanics, and only tells the characters things, not the players, that DM can never do the dying last words purely for dramatic convenience, or homage, or any 'out of game' reason. Because the physics for the world have been set, and [U]cure light wounds causes the process of dying to cease[/U]. That [I]would [/I] be confusing his players if he did that. Maybe they [I]would[/I] wonder about some of the other calls. That DM must always have an in game explanation, mechanically justifiable too, for why the cure light wounds didn’t work. And to be worthy of screen time it probably should be part of the story. And it should be possible for the characters to find out why, though they might never actually do so. I’ve run and played in games where the levers have been set at various ends of the spectrum, especially the character vs. player perception of the world one. The current game is probably the most self aware. At times it seems the characters almost seem to be unconsciously aware that they are characters in d&d. Almost. We (my gaming group) have chosen the ‘order of the stick’ approach deliberately. It is actually really fun. It is light hearted too, which is important when everyone is tired and real life is a bit rough. And most of all, it cuts out – at the cost of some story lines and experiences – a lot of “realistic” dead time. My little team basically doesn’t have time to game. We are lucky to have 12 sessions a year. Everyone has made it very clear that right at the moment we don’t have time to have an immersive, simulationist experience if that means we spend a whole session following up the wrong leads, not advancing the story, not killing things, and taking their stuff. And it's fun! In the future, when the situation is different, we’ll adjust the levers again, and play differently. That will be great too. - Rassilon (ps: sorry about the long post) (pps: not so sorry that I didn’t still post it) [/QUOTE]
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