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<blockquote data-quote="Nail" data-source="post: 1577928" data-attributes="member: 224">Excellent prose, Al!&nbsp; What a summary.&nbsp; Carry on!Fluent rhetoric aside, I think you've set up a number of straw-man arguements here:
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<li data-xf-list-type="ul">Multi-class cherry picking: You assume too much about &quot;most players&quot;.&nbsp; Multi-classing to get max ranks in a skill is....a poor decision, at best; that's shown throughout the ENBoards.&nbsp; The net result is not stellar; in part you've forgotten about how many skill points other classes get.&nbsp; </li>
<li data-xf-list-type="ul">reduces cross-class division: Paying for cross-class skills each level is not a munchkin's choice, I assure you.&nbsp; Do you do this often, for your PCs?&nbsp; Let's look at another very useful skill (with an armor penalty, like Sneak): Tumble.&nbsp; Do your non-Rogues have this skill maxed?&nbsp; How about other players in your group?</li>
<li data-xf-list-type="ul">propagates Stealth:&nbsp; See above.</li>
<li data-xf-list-type="ul">Mis-matched skills: Not a problem, as the d20 system already has examples of this.&nbsp; Check out the grapple mechanic.</li>
<li data-xf-list-type="ul">&quot;Charybdis of Clunk&quot;: You should win the discussion, just for using this phrase.&nbsp; Well done!&nbsp; The &quot;Clunk&quot; of which you speak, however, has no teeth.&nbsp; It's a simple in-game question to determine which skill (Spot-visual, Sense-everything else) to use.&nbsp; It's not caused either confusion or slow-down.</li>
</ul>&nbsp;Al, your proposal is only marginally simplier than what we've done.&nbsp; Marginally, at best.-&quot;hell-bent&quot; Nail, stuck in Scylla's craw</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Nail, post: 1577928, member: 224"] Excellent prose, Al! What a summary. Carry on! Fluent rhetoric aside, I think you've set up a number of straw-man arguements here:[list][*]Multi-class cherry picking: You assume too much about "most players". Multi-classing to get max ranks in a skill is....a poor decision, at best; that's shown throughout the ENBoards. The net result is not stellar; in part you've forgotten about how many skill points other classes get. [*]reduces cross-class division: Paying for cross-class skills each level is not a munchkin's choice, I assure you. Do you do this often, for your PCs? Let's look at another very useful skill (with an armor penalty, like Sneak): Tumble. Do your non-Rogues have this skill maxed? How about other players in your group? [*]propagates Stealth: See above. [*]Mis-matched skills: Not a problem, as the d20 system already has examples of this. Check out the grapple mechanic. [*]"Charybdis of Clunk": You should win the discussion, just for using this phrase. Well done! The "Clunk" of which you speak, however, has no teeth. It's a simple in-game question to determine which skill (Spot-visual, Sense-everything else) to use. It's not caused either confusion or slow-down.[/list] [b]Al[/b], your proposal is only marginally simplier than what we've done. Marginally, at best. -"hell-bent" Nail, stuck in Scylla's craw [/QUOTE]

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