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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Ashtagon" data-source="post: 6048682" data-attributes="member: 72335">My personal take on it (and this may or may not be a house rule; but it is how I rule it) is that you can attempt to use hips anytime, anyplace. Whether it works against any particular individual or not depends on whether or not that individual perceives the space you are in as having dim illumination (nb. I prefer to call it "dim illumination", to distinguish from situations which merely require "a shadow to be present"). It is perfectly possible for it to work against some targets who are present and fail against others.Whether or not you see yourself as being in dim illumination is not relevant, unless for some odd reason you are trying to hide from yourself. Your own visual senses won't affect whether it works against anyone else present.Suppose I am successfully hiding from a human in a dimly-lit room and an elf (or dwarf) walks in. Their superior vision means I am in an area of bright illumination as they perceive it. For them, the hips is irrelevant, because they see me as being in an area with bright illumination, and hips requires dim illumination. But their ability to see right through it has no effect on the human who was present; that human continues to fail to see me, because his normal vision means he perceives me as being in an area of dim illumination.----Going back to my torch...Consider this diagram:[code]TBBDDVVVVWWWWWWWWWWWWW[/code]T - torchB - bright lightD - dim illuminationV - darknessW - darknessFor a human, B is bright light, D is dim light, and both V and W are total darkness.An elf can see areas marked V as if it were dim light. And yet by your interpretation it is total darkness, which common sense tells me is a total lack of light, which should make any sight impossible. Clearly, there is something different about the light levels in V and W, which elves can detect but humans cannot. If they are both simply "total darkness" and that's that, why do they behave differently for elves and other low-light vision races?</blockquote>

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