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<blockquote data-quote="Ovinomancer" data-source="post: 7528933" data-attributes="member: 16814">No.  Hide doesn't require Unseen by RAW, it requires &quot;not seen clearly.&quot; Further, Lightfoit halfling hide diesn't require unseen, nor dies ranger hide in plain sight.  I'll grant many (most) hides are while already unseen, but it's not a requirement.You're arguing from the specific to the general.  Also, yrivially countered by Lightfoot halfling hide trait. Again, unseen is not a requirement.  Hidden grants unseen if not already in place.  A Ranger using hide in plain sight can make a weapon attack while hidden and get unseen even if normal conditions for unseen do not prevail.  Skulker can hide and attack from hidden while unseen with dim lighting being the only condition.  This is avoiding a discussion about normally attacking while hidden as tgat's ruling prone (and it appears we'd disagree anyway).As a member of this community, I've pointed out where the rules of the  game already cover blindness adequetely.   You're free to want more if tgat doesn't suffice, but you seemed unaware you already had that alternative by focusing on how blindness doesn't explicitly provide you specifics.  I offered an alternative and recognozed you might still want more.Now that we're done being pedantic and patronizing, what's your issue with addressing blindness within the normal play loop?</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Ovinomancer, post: 7528933, member: 16814"] No. Hide doesn't require Unseen by RAW, it requires "not seen clearly." Further, Lightfoit halfling hide diesn't require unseen, nor dies ranger hide in plain sight. I'll grant many (most) hides are while already unseen, but it's not a requirement. You're arguing from the specific to the general. Also, yrivially countered by Lightfoot halfling hide trait. Again, unseen is not a requirement. Hidden grants unseen if not already in place. A Ranger using hide in plain sight can make a weapon attack while hidden and get unseen even if normal conditions for unseen do not prevail. Skulker can hide and attack from hidden while unseen with dim lighting being the only condition. This is avoiding a discussion about normally attacking while hidden as tgat's ruling prone (and it appears we'd disagree anyway). As a member of this community, I've pointed out where the rules of the game[i] already cover [/i]blindness adequetely. You're free to want more if tgat doesn't suffice, but you seemed unaware you already had that alternative by focusing on how blindness doesn't explicitly provide you specifics. I offered an alternative and recognozed you might still want more. Now that we're done being pedantic and patronizing, what's your issue with addressing blindness within the normal play loop? [/QUOTE]

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