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<blockquote data-quote="Lizard" data-source="post: 4614247" data-attributes="member: 1054">Well, to be fair...Level-based costs were in 3e as well -- magic items, etc. There was, however, nothing I can think of which cost more per character level: It cost as much to Raise a 1st level Commoner as an Epic level Wizard. I can accept, though, that The Powers That Be value the souls of the powerful more than the lowly, and need more bribes to let them go back.For the second case, the answer to both is &quot;Rituals&quot;. I don't mind saying, &quot;Graz'zt has a ritual you haven't learned&quot;. I do object to the idea I don't need to work out the ritual's level, limits, cost, and so on, so I can be fair about it, and, more importantly, give the players the chance to FIND those limits and overcome them. Saying, &quot;It's a demon ritual, you can't cast it nyeah&quot; is borderline acceptable, if handled right. Saying, &quot;It can do anything I want it to, screw you!&quot; is not. Rather, it should go like this.Player: How does he keep knowing where to send his cultists?DM: Good question. Why don't you try to find the answer!Player: Arcana check 35!DM: Well, you're not sure, but you know who is.. the old Sage so-and-so, who lives in the Tower Of Certain Doom.Players: We're off!(Much later)DM: OK, the sage tells you of the ritual Graz'zt uses. It can be blocked only be walls made with mortar mixed with ground dragonbone... from a freshly killed dragon. Fortunately, there's one a few miles down the road...Players: We're off! Again!And so, finally, they've built a spy-prood citadel. Or at least proof against Graz'zts ritual, and probably all those of other Devils, just to be fair. Demons, though... <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile&nbsp; &nbsp; :)"&nbsp; data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />&quot;He can 'cause he can, OK?&quot; is just poor storytelling in my opinion. No matter the game, no matter the version, the world must have rules which the players can identify and use.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Lizard, post: 4614247, member: 1054"] Well, to be fair... Level-based costs were in 3e as well -- magic items, etc. There was, however, nothing I can think of which cost more per character level: It cost as much to Raise a 1st level Commoner as an Epic level Wizard. I can accept, though, that The Powers That Be value the souls of the powerful more than the lowly, and need more bribes to let them go back. For the second case, the answer to both is "Rituals". I don't mind saying, "Graz'zt has a ritual you haven't learned". I do object to the idea I don't need to work out the ritual's level, limits, cost, and so on, so I can be fair about it, and, more importantly, give the players the chance to FIND those limits and overcome them. Saying, "It's a demon ritual, you can't cast it nyeah" is borderline acceptable, if handled right. Saying, "It can do anything I want it to, screw you!" is not. Rather, it should go like this. Player: How does he keep knowing where to send his cultists? DM: Good question. Why don't you try to find the answer! Player: Arcana check 35! DM: Well, you're not sure, but you know who is.. the old Sage so-and-so, who lives in the Tower Of Certain Doom. Players: We're off! (Much later) DM: OK, the sage tells you of the ritual Graz'zt uses. It can be blocked only be walls made with mortar mixed with ground dragonbone... from a freshly killed dragon. Fortunately, there's one a few miles down the road... Players: We're off! Again! And so, finally, they've built a spy-prood citadel. Or at least proof against Graz'zts ritual, and probably all those of other Devils, just to be fair. Demons, though... :) "He can 'cause he can, OK?" is just poor storytelling in my opinion. No matter the game, no matter the version, the world must have rules which the players can identify and use. [/QUOTE]

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