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Message: <blockquote data-quote="pming" data-source="post: 7110313" data-attributes="member: 45197">Hiya!Er...nope. Never had these problems, sorry. Well, wait, I guess I should rephrase that. I've never seen these things as "problems". Yeah, that fits better.A Cleric healing?! WTF?! That's...thats....oh, wait...that's one of the core things that they can do that distinguishes the class. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" /> Of course they are healing a lot. Who else is going to do it? The fighter? The thief? The magic-user? Did the Cleric have to heal all the time? Nope. In fact I've had players play "non-healing" clerics fairly often, comparatively speaking. Probably...10 to 20 percent of all clerics I've DM'ed over the decades haven't really had 'heal-bot' in their description. Most of them did heal...some more than others....but that's to be expected. It's like someone bringing a fighter into the group and when the PC's get attacked by an ogre the fighter says Oh, no, sorry guys. I killed a man in a bar fight when I was 16...I'm a pacifist. I will only kill if there is no other option. The ogre is attacking the thief, not me, so, sorry... my hands are tied. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" />"Older editions" where the "only powerful classes were spellcasters". <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f635.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt="o_O" title="Er... what?    o_O"  data-smilie="12"data-shortname="o_O" /> First, I/we never played 4e. So I'm ignoring it completely...as usual. 'Nuff said.  Ahem. Mostly we play 1e/Hackmaster or BECMI/DarkDungeons as our D&D fix. Recently (last two years?) it has been 5th. Nobody has ever gotten a character higher than level 7, though, so I can't really speak for high-level 5e.Ahem. With regards to 1e/2e/HM/BECMI...nope, not seeing it. The most powerful "spellcasters" are probably in the BECMI zone due to a few spells being so extremely helpful to the group as a whole, that everyone does want to protect them (spells like Woodform, Clothform, and their ilk are very 'powerful', in the campaign effect sense). The "problem" (although I don't see it that way) with high-level spellcasters in 1e/2e/HM/BECMI is their woefully low HP's and generally bad AC's. Can a high-level wizard absolutely ruin the day of a group of baddies? Hell yeah! Can a trio of goblins with flaming arrows absolutely ruin the day of a high-level wizard? Hell yeah! In 1e, in particular, a 16th level wizard was lucky to have 26hp and AC 6 (about AC 14 in 5e terms). A 20' pit trap with a couple of spikes at the bottom could kill him. A dragons breath was pretty much instant death, regardless of Save. Hell, as many have laughed at over the years, a freaking PO'ed house cat could kill a wizard in no short order.Bottom Line: Never seen nor had a problem with clerics or high-level spellcasters. ^_^Paul L. Ming</blockquote>

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