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<blockquote data-quote="The Little Raven" data-source="post: 4024473" data-attributes="member: 10095">And this is different from any other edition of any roleplaying game... how? 3E hype it's feats and skills (replacement for non-weapon proficiencies),BAB (replacement for Thac0), saving throws (three standard instead of the oddity of the old ones), experience chart (one standard instead of ones for each class), class/race limits, and all that stuff based on what 2e had previously done. The entire marketing campaign was pretty much &quot;How is this game different from 2e?&quot;4e is saying 3e sucked as much as 3e said 2e sucked... all the way back to OD&amp;D.And these problems are based directly on player feedback. ENWorld itself has hosted dozens of threads discussing the issues highlighted by the marketing of the game. What Lizard is implying through his arguments is that they're trying to tell us these are problems, as opposed to the truth: we know these are problems, and we've told them that over the past 8 years, and that's why it's being changed.They keep saying &quot;we&quot; (as in, them) when talking about having more fun, and the hope that you will have just as much fun as they are. I see nothing in &quot;We're having more fun with 4e than any previous edition, and we hope you do too&quot; that says &quot;Previous editions are unfun,&quot; which is what is being claimed by some posters (like Lizard).</blockquote>

[QUOTE="The Little Raven, post: 4024473, member: 10095"] And this is different from any other edition of any roleplaying game... how? 3E hype it's feats and skills (replacement for non-weapon proficiencies),BAB (replacement for Thac0), saving throws (three standard instead of the oddity of the old ones), experience chart (one standard instead of ones for each class), class/race limits, and all that stuff based on what 2e had previously done. The entire marketing campaign was pretty much "How is this game different from 2e?" 4e is saying 3e sucked as much as 3e said 2e sucked... all the way back to OD&D. And these problems are based directly on player feedback. ENWorld itself has hosted dozens of threads discussing the issues highlighted by the marketing of the game. What Lizard is implying through his arguments is that they're trying to tell us these are problems, as opposed to the truth: we know these are problems, and we've told them that over the past 8 years, and that's why it's being changed. They keep saying "we" (as in, them) when talking about having more fun, and the hope that you will have just as much fun as they are. I see nothing in "We're having more fun with 4e than any previous edition, and we hope you do too" that says "Previous editions are unfun," which is what is being claimed by some posters (like Lizard). [/QUOTE]

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