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<blockquote data-quote="CullAfulMoshuN" data-source="post: 457622" data-attributes="member: 1270">Subdual damage can never take someone to -10 because it is not subtracted from the targets hit points, but instead accumulated as a seperate total.&nbsp; If the subdual total ever exceeds the current hit point total the target is knocked out. (Subdual Damage PHB P134)I agree with the critical success point of view.&nbsp; Since hit points a not necessarily a measure of physical toughness (from character levels anyway), but more of a means of quantifying skill and luck and the reason why important characters are usually the ones who survive things most would not walk away from.&nbsp; It does not represent that a high level character getting hit by a longsword calmly plucks it unconcerned from his chest and beats his 1st level opponent to death with a back hand slap from his gauntlet.&nbsp; Instead though luck and skill he managed to deflect the soldiers viscious sword thrust aside just in time to avoid being skewered, with only a slight bruise from where it skimmed across his chainmail.So from the same reasoning, a critical hit in the same instance does not even necessarily denote a dangerous wound (critical from longsword takes 14hp from above fighters pool of 120hp as opposed to 7hp), more that his luck is running out faster, as he was also winded a bit from the strike. (I also use DnDChicks critical tables though, so it could potentially be much worse).My above demonstration intends to depict that critical hits as simply more successful blows than usual, not necessarily vital wounds. So the goes for a subdual attack, with the intent to knock out, rather than kill.&nbsp; A critical success should operate on the intent of the action, not the mechanics, so should never do real damage rather than subdual.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="CullAfulMoshuN, post: 457622, member: 1270"] Subdual damage can never take someone to -10 because it is not subtracted from the targets hit points, but instead accumulated as a seperate total. If the subdual total ever exceeds the current hit point total the target is knocked out. (Subdual Damage PHB P134) I agree with the critical success point of view. Since hit points a not necessarily a measure of physical toughness (from character levels anyway), but more of a means of quantifying skill and luck and the reason why important characters are usually the ones who survive things most would not walk away from. It does not represent that a high level character getting hit by a longsword calmly plucks it unconcerned from his chest and beats his 1st level opponent to death with a back hand slap from his gauntlet. Instead though luck and skill he managed to deflect the soldiers viscious sword thrust aside just in time to avoid being skewered, with only a slight bruise from where it skimmed across his chainmail. So from the same reasoning, a critical hit in the same instance does not even necessarily denote a dangerous wound (critical from longsword takes 14hp from above fighters pool of 120hp as opposed to 7hp), more that his luck is running out faster, as he was also winded a bit from the strike. (I also use DnDChicks critical tables though, so it could potentially be much worse). My above demonstration intends to depict that critical hits as simply more successful blows than usual, not necessarily vital wounds. So the goes for a subdual attack, with the intent to knock out, rather than kill. A critical success should operate on the intent of the action, not the mechanics, so should never do real damage rather than subdual. [/QUOTE]

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