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Message: <blockquote data-quote="LokiDR" data-source="post: 940507" data-attributes="member: 6239">Yes, the debate is whether control of the flight spell is physical or mental action.The spell physically moves you: irrelevant.  Purely mental actions in a world of magic can cause physical movement.Fly requires a move-equivelant action to move a person: irrelevant.  That is only a measure of the kind of time and concentration the spell requires to use.  See flaming sphere.So what does fly need?  What does it say it needs?  It only requires concentration in the spell description.  Concentration is a mental action.  Hence fly is a mental action.  Can I make that any clearer?Your silent teleport has moved you.  Change in position over time.  Your explanation does not explain telekinisis.    Mine does.  Are you saying you can't use a spell-like ability of telekinisis to pick yourself up and move your body by virtue of the spell?The end result is meaningless.  We have been saying this all along, but that is all you have focused on.Hold is meant to be paralasis, not some dimensia that you can't move.The question then is whether controling fly is a mental or physical action.  See above.What does the fly spell require?What movements of body would be impossible?You are taking rule segments out of context and trying to build an arguement around it.  This bothers me.  There is no rule that calls use of the fly spell "physical movement".  You are using english and somatics.  I am looking at the description of the fly spell.In no place does the description of Enchantment:Compulsion state that it changes the thoughts of the target.  A dominated person doesn't want to do those things they are commanded to do, but they are commpelled to do them.  Spells do only what they say they do.  A compulsion spell can change the way a person's mind works, and one way that can be visualized is disabling the motor centers of the brain and spinal cord.  This is a visualization of altering the way a mind works, but it is consistant with the description of the compulsion sub-school and the Hold Person spell.I don't think allowing use of the fly spell while under hold person is a house rule.  I think stopping a person in mid-air with hold person is a house rule.By the way, if things really were that open to interpretation, no house rules would be neccessary unless a clarification of this situation was published.  House rules contradict published rules.</blockquote>

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