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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Quickleaf" data-source="post: 7157502" data-attributes="member: 20323">I don't think you're grokking what I'm saying. Let me go through your examples and explain how those are different from your proposed 24-hour no-concentration 1st-level produce flame bonus action variant...Cleric - War Domain - War Priest 1st level featureThis lets you make a weapon attack as a bonus action Wisdom modifier #times/long rest. You could sacred flame (action) and weapon attack (bonus action), for example. This is different from what you suggest in 3 ways:<ol> <li data-xf-list-type="ol">Your produce flame could let you use a cantrip (action) + produce flame (bonus action). Letting a PC use two spells on their turn for a 1st level slot (whose effect is ongoing without concentration) is unquestionably OP.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ol">Your produce flame relies on your primary attribute. A War Domain Cleric is relying either on Strength or Dexterity (secondary attributes).</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ol">Your produce flame is better because there's no limit on #times you can throw the flame as a bonus action. 24 hours is a long long time, easily letting you surpass the War Priest feature.</li> </ol>Not the same.Fighter - Second Wind 2nd level featureSecond Wind is a an ability wholly unique to the Fighter - no other class gets bonus action healing, so it's a poor example to choose as a comparison because it's apples-to-oranges. If we do compare them, however, we see that Second Wind is limited by requiring a short or long rest. Your produce flame, however, lasts for 24 hours.  Not the same.Warlock - 1st level hex spellThere's a difference between "bonus action to cast" and "bonus action to make an attack with an ongoing spell." With hex, the +1d6 damage is limited by concentration (1 hour). I think it's very telling of how OP your produce flame variant is, that hex  lasts for 24 hours if cast with a 5th level spell slot (and even then still requires concentration).Not the same.Druid - shillelagh cantripShillelagh is the best comparison of those you gave IMO. It empowers a staff to deal d8 instead of d6, makes it magical, and lets you use your Wisdom instead of Strength. It does NOT let you make a bonus action attack, however. Your sacred flame lets you make a bonus action attack dealing 1d8 damage.Not the same.It's also worth noting that hex is a Warlock-only spell & shillelagh is a Druid-only spell that is hard for other PCs to get without using optional rules like feats/multiclassing. This point is more subjective, but I suspect it has to do with the party roles the designers were trying to steer certain classes toward. YMMV about whether that's important in your games.Ultimately, everyone has to find the metric for balance that works at their table. A casual group not too concerned with balance could allow your version, likely without it rocking the boat too much. Personally, I would not use it in my games without toning it down.</blockquote>

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