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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Coriat" data-source="post: 2858198" data-attributes="member: 20011">For me it's relative scale. Demon princes compete with the gods. That doesn't work if the gods are CR 60 and they are CR 20. Demon princes have survived for countless millenia in the Abyss, probably one of the most dangerous places in the planes. That doesn't work if a pair of the infinite number of balors the Abyss spawns can get together and slap them around. Demon princes marshal armies of lesser demons, generally through sheer intimidation. That doesn't work if a half-dozen of the mariliths in those armies can team up and take down the being enslaving them (since a demon is almost certain to resent being conscripted by a demon prince)What's so shoddy about a balor? A single balor has the power to devastate entire kingdoms of the mortal world if it goes unchecked. The folks who slay it will probably be remembered as heroes for generations. Or, a pit fiend can cast wish too. It's all a matter of how you handle it - just because there are more pit fiends out there doesn't mean that the defeat of a pit fiend on one world has to be less memorable for the inhabitants.You don't like epic level campaigns, that's fine. That, to me, means that the 20th level party's defeat of the terrible Trismegistus, a balor who led an invading army of demons, is going to be the subject of the epic poems 2000 years down the line. I really don't see why the demon lords must be brought to the party's level when there are already perfectly fine fiendish threats for a 20th level party to face.</blockquote>

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