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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Ripzerai" data-source="post: 2858280" data-attributes="member: 38324">Exactly! A balor - with appropriately powerful henchmen, magic items, allies, and intelligence, all the things people assume Abyssal lords have - is a perfectly good "epic" foe for 20th level parties to defeat at the end of a long and dangerous quest. There's no shame in defeating Trismegistus the Balor General; even Conan would approve. When you feel you need to leap directly from Trismegistus the CR 20 Balor to Baphomet the CR 20 Demon Prince, I see a disconnect. Baphomet should have a number of unique servitors who put balors to shame, and he should, in turn, put them to shame. Of course challengers will from time to time show up that provide a credible threat to him, but if the average Type VI demon is such a credible threat, he has a problem.If Baphomet is no more powerful than the balor, the balor is just as glorious and epic a threat. every bit as worthy a target. The only difference is, Baphomet has more power than he can plausibly hold in his Darwinian nightmare realm.The game was designed - has always been designed - to provide a hierarchy of foes. First you fight goblins and then you fight hobgoblins, then you fight bugbears. Then ogres, then hill giants, then fire giants. Then demons, then archdemons, then Abyssal lords, then Abyssal princes. When balors and Abyssal lords are approximately equal (again, acknowledging the lack of precision in CRs), it sets the precedent that nothing should be so powerful that 20th level parties can't take it on, which is silly. So demigods are no more powerful than balors? Greater gods are no more powerful than demigods? Why should the entire multiverse flatline just because your PCs do?</blockquote>

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