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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Gold Roger" data-source="post: 2858813" data-attributes="member: 33904">What good does the mythology of tough demon princes when only ever the epic playing minority encounters them in combat? The demon princes are most likely a bit high on their power/CR ratio.I remember killing demogorgon in the BG2 game. What for? Mostly the xp. Still, that guy was an awesome and unique opponent and when I came about him learning to play and master D&D I immediatly made a connection with the D&D mythos.I'm a great fan of the D&D mythos. I use planescape and spelljammer in my homebrew games. But I want to play with the mythos.The real greatness of the D&D mythos is not the nice pictures and stories, but the stories people tell each other how they appeared in each others game. In each of that stories the personalities of the monsters where the same as where their rough ability outlines and appearance. But player x met Grazzt bound in a archmages crypt and bargained with him at third level, player y killed him when he was in his "kill things and take their stuff phase" and got killed by him when he said the name trice and the DM was a jerk, while player z had him as BBEG in his great metaplot campaign where he fought his projection at level 20 to prevent him from invading his world and draining the great cave of souls.Just like mindflayers can be alien meances, world invaders, elder evils, spelljammers, great overlords or just little weels in a greater scheeme and the Gith queen has propably died many times, in many different ways, the demon princes and their mythos is mutable.And what is everybody hung up over the lowest CR archfiend anyway? Jubilex is a big chump of disgusting slime with few servants anyway, isn't he? Isn't that guy the joke of the abyss anyway?Add in only one line, either "controls abyssal layers" or "away from home" and things get reasonable quickly. Getting hung up about one or two sentences missing (we're not even 100% sure they are missing) is a bit much.</blockquote>

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