Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.

Reply to thread

Message: <blockquote data-quote="Ripzerai" data-source="post: 2865731" data-attributes="member: 38324">Because they retooled the game to better support play at levels 1-20. In 1e, there were few if any monsters worthy of the attention of a 20th level party. One of the design criteria of 3e was to make it so PCs could more smoothly advance all the way to level 20 (so, for example, PC HD continue increasing). In 3.5, they realized that balors, with only 13 HD, didn't last long enough in combat to use all their interesting abilities. So they redefined them to be higher-level opponents. Now, at last, the game "finishes" at level 20 with a terrible demon caste in a dramatic clash against beings of utter evil. Doing so set an implicit lower limit to what demon lords should be, as demon lords are the obvious opponents to fight after you're done with balors. You're right: if they hadn't retooled the balor (and, with it, other fiends, creating a smooth progression of fiend-bashing up to 20th level), most of this debate wouldn't be happening. But they did, for reasons which were pretty sound. And, acknowledging that this has happened, it's silly - even ridiculous - to say that demon lords should also be level 20 opponents.It's not even primarily about whether or not demon lords can reasonably hold their thrones against balor challengers. It's about putting demon lords where they've always been - above Type VI demons in power. Do demon princes have bodyguards, allies, armies, and fortresses? Of course they do. But so do balors.Is it anything to get worked up about? Of course not. Is it anything anyone should get worked up about in defending it? Of course not. It's an issue as indefensible as it is insignificant. It's hypocritical to waste dozens of posts telling people what a minor point it is - when you post that often on the subject, you're implicitly lending it credibility. You're saying that defending it is as big a deal to you as attacking it is to others. The irony is, I don't think it's that big a deal to anyone. But this is the internet, and message board arguments can swell up in subjective importance.</blockquote>

Verification