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"Hot" take: Aesthetically-pleasing rules are highly overvalued
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<blockquote data-quote="AbdulAlhazred" data-source="post: 8112641" data-attributes="member: 82106"><p>Right, just to clarify, this is the function of the SC in 4e. Sadly 5e eschews this, and thus there simply are no rules for these types of situations. The DM simply decides which sorts of checks and how many will produce what fictional and mechanical result. What I contend is that this leads to a situation where the player MUST be entirely a "Character advocate" and the DM is inevitably cast into the role of saying what the player is 'allowed' to get (and if dice are used, it is entirely the DM who decides if enough have been tossed, he can ask for one more check at any point, so in effect the outcome is his to decide, the dice are just a fig leaf outside of combat).</p><p></p><p>In something like Dungeon World, by contrast, there is a fictional position, the player makes a 'move', and that has a rules-designated effect, almost like a chess move, in which the positioning changes. There's a lot of leeway on the part of the DM here, but in effect all his leeway is boxed up in his options to make moves of his own (hard or soft depending on the result of the check associated with the player's move, or some other well-defined considerations). The DM in that game also has a very explicit agenda and set of resources, etc. which are available. While he can 'draw the map' so to speak, he doesn't really have a LOT of say in how the PCs decide to traverse it.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="AbdulAlhazred, post: 8112641, member: 82106"] Right, just to clarify, this is the function of the SC in 4e. Sadly 5e eschews this, and thus there simply are no rules for these types of situations. The DM simply decides which sorts of checks and how many will produce what fictional and mechanical result. What I contend is that this leads to a situation where the player MUST be entirely a "Character advocate" and the DM is inevitably cast into the role of saying what the player is 'allowed' to get (and if dice are used, it is entirely the DM who decides if enough have been tossed, he can ask for one more check at any point, so in effect the outcome is his to decide, the dice are just a fig leaf outside of combat). In something like Dungeon World, by contrast, there is a fictional position, the player makes a 'move', and that has a rules-designated effect, almost like a chess move, in which the positioning changes. There's a lot of leeway on the part of the DM here, but in effect all his leeway is boxed up in his options to make moves of his own (hard or soft depending on the result of the check associated with the player's move, or some other well-defined considerations). The DM in that game also has a very explicit agenda and set of resources, etc. which are available. While he can 'draw the map' so to speak, he doesn't really have a LOT of say in how the PCs decide to traverse it. [/QUOTE]
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"Hot" take: Aesthetically-pleasing rules are highly overvalued
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