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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Skanth" data-source="post: 634540" data-attributes="member: 6852">I have a problem with the rules as written because they just don't make sense to my mind.An ordinary joe in a bar fight doesn't know about about lethal punches, non-lethal punches, he just hits.My players will say something like "I smash my fist into his face!" I don't want to ask them if they are doing it in a lethal or non-lethal way. What's the difference?Also my players wont accept that they can kick and punch a guy x times and have no affect whatsoever on him.In fact changing from one style of attack (non-lethal) to another (lethal) actually implies some sort of skill and training and sounds more like a martial art.Also a -4 is a big deal to low level characters.What am I going to go with?Something like pbartender's idea I guess or maybe stick with subdual damage but increase its healing time.</blockquote>