House rules for races higher than LA+0

[yipwyg]

I read earlier about someone wondering if having negative levels for monsters higher than La+0 would work. I have been working on this and would like peoples opinions on it.

Note: Characters in my campaign start with max hit points.

ECL = LA + Racial HD

For races higher than LA +0 they get the following penalties per Level Adjustment. Note I have a separate one based on Racial HD.
–1 on all skill checks and ability checks.
–1 on attack rolls and saving throws.
–1 effective level (whenever the creatureÂ’s level is used in a die roll or calculation, reduce it by one for each negative level).

For each Racial HD they get the above plus
–5 hit points

The reason for LA penalties are separate from Racial HD ones is due to templates and races that don't have Racial HD like drow.

Under the above rules this is how a Lizardman Fighter would be like this.

ECL 4 (LA +1 + 2 Racial HD + 1 level Fighter)
-3 to skill and ability checks
-3 to attack rolls and saving throws
-3 effective level
-10 hit points (starts with 1d10 + 2d8 totaling 26) however with the -10 hit points would be 16.

He must earn xp equal to a 5th level character before attaining 2nd level in a class.

Drow Fighter would be like this

ECL 3 (LA +2 + 1 level Fighter)
-2 to skill and ability checks
-2 to attack rolls and saving throws
-2 effective character level
no loss of hp due to the fact no racial HD.

He must earn xp equal to a 4th level character before attaing 2nd level in a class.

Note as he gains xp he buys off the penalties.

The Lizardman and Drow attains enough xp for 2nd level, the penalties reduce by one, and the lizard man gains 5 hp. This continues until all negative levels are gone.

What do you think?

 

[Fieari]

Hm. The buyoff might be a bit too easy in this case. Why not use the normal LA buyoff rules?

 

[Paraxis]

You do not buy of the LA penalty, with this system you always have the lost levels like normal. It just allows you to start at first level with a normaly unplayable race. I think it might work but to be honest I hate the whole LA system the way it is. I wish someone would come up with a better mechanic for it.

 

[Fieari]

Err... but you do buy off the penalties... that's the same thing as buying off the levels.

Another question... what if the series of -5 hp would put you below 1 hp? I'm assuming the whole purpose of this concept is to allow bigger races at level one, but most of those have LOTS of racial HD. Consider someone wanting to start as a succubus for instance... which is a perfectly reasonable roleplaying option to want to do... but all those racial HD!

 

[Quartz]

Another question... what if the series of -5 hp would put you below 1 hp?

He starts PCs off with max HP, so a 5HD creature starts off with (5x8) - (5x5) + class HP, i.e. +15 HP.

 

[yipwyg]

Err... but you do buy off the penalties... that's the same thing as buying off the levels.

you do buy off some penalties, however when you finish you end up as if you just started at a higher level.

For example a lizardman fighter and a dwarf fighter are adventuring together. Starting them out the same, this is how it would look like

Lizardman 1st level fighter -- ECL = 4 he starts with xp = to a 4th level character
Dwarf 4th level fighter -- ECL = 4 he also starts with xp = to a 4th level character

under my system this is how it would work

Lizardman 1st level fighter -- ECL = 1 (close to equivalent with the penalties) starts with 0 xp
Dwarf 1st level fighter -- ECL = 1, starts with 0 xp

when lizardman gains 3 levels he would be ECL 4 with xp = to a 4th level character his penalties will be gone and will have all the benefits of the race
the dwarf with the same xp amount will also be 4th level.

if you would like I will post the table the lizardman.

Succubus would be the following

HD 6, LA 6

Level adjustment penalties
-6 to hit
-6 to saves
-6 to skills
-6 character level checks

Racial HD penalties
-6 to hit
-6 to saves
-6 to skills
-6 character level checks
-5 hit points per racial HD (30)

So starting out at 1st level
-12 to hit
-12 to saves
-12 to skill checks
-12 character level checks
Starting hit points (6d8) 48 - (Racial penalties) 30 = 18 points at 1st level
She also gets con bonus and max hit points from her class.
As she levels she regains lost hit points at a rate of 5 hit points per level until reaches max hit points of 48 + Class Level + Con
She needs to get 14 levels of xp before she can attain 2nd level in her class.

 

[yipwyg]

Now the succubus is pretty extreme. I will probably just limit my races to Humanoids, Goblinoids, and some minor giants like ogres.

 

[yipwyg]

ya I don't like the system that much either, so looking for a quick fix that works. Savage species is pretty good, however the above is easier than breaking everything down.

 

[whydirt]

One thing I've thought about testing out is giving characters with an ECL of +1 or greater a number of levels in the Commoner class equal to the ECL.

 

[MLIrons]

Alternative Idea

I have a different house rule for dealing with creatures with LA's. I have been messing around with a XP penalty (similar to those brough on for characters who multiclass when with classes outside their racial boundaries) that a creature must gain in order to advance in a class. The XP needed to advance a level is 4% x LA number (example, a succubus would have to gain 24% more XP to advance in another class). If the race has favored class, then the penalty is for taking that class is only 2%.