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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Mephista" data-source="post: 7266713" data-attributes="member: 6786252">I think the main problem with INT is the same problem that CHA had in previous editions.  In fact, I'd argue that CHA still suffers from - unless its your main stat, the skills just aren't very useful, and there's little reason to take it.  Sure, every part wants someone with Arcane knowledge.  That comes up relatively often.  But history, religion and nature? Not as much.  Investigation is pretty weak compared to Perception.  If you have one person covering the Arcane checks, you really don't need the rest.  Same thing with CHA.  You just need one person in the party to cover the social situations, and everyone else can safely ignore the stat.  WIS is universally good because its basically is mental CON.  Resist most mental effects, resist social manipulation, resist stealth.  Plus a few others like animal handling, survival and medicine.When all is said and done, I think the main problem here is that WIS is just too good.  You have all the same reasons people want a good CON (survivability), then you add in a popular stat for one third of classes (monk, druid, ranger, cleric) as well as a number of skills that everyone wants.  3e was really the only edition that I can remember where INT was so hugely important.  It was a prerequisite for many feats, it added to skills, it taught you languages, and there were a number of classes that made use of it.  Other games didn't put as much emphasis on it as I recall.There's a couple of solutions you could try.<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Take inspiration from 3e for added skills or languages</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Tinker with classes so they use more Int for spells / techniques</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Move relevant skills away from WIS</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Make crafting important- crafting uses INT</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Reshuffle saves so players have to make CHA and INT saves more often</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Call for Int checks more - figure out how to work Nature, Religion and Investigation into the game and not come off as a poor man's Survival and Perception (and figure out an actual use for Religion?).</li> </ul>Also, if INT is being treated like CHA now, should something be done about CHA being a dump stat?  The only reason CHA is used more than INT now is simply because we have 4 classes that use CHA for spellcasting (paladin, warlock, sorcerer, bard).  Its not like anyone outside those four won't dump CHA just as easily as others.  If that's the only criteria, then the only fair solution is to make INT relevant for classes like Fighters and Rogues (who have INT as a save).</blockquote>

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