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<blockquote data-quote="Shiroiken" data-source="post: 8806227" data-attributes="member: 6775477">Whenever I have a lock that gets used, I always write where the key is found (usually who's carrying it). My players look for keys, because they know someone must have them. Of course, I thew them for a loop once against a master thief, who destroyed the key and just picked it each time. Obviously an old lock that never sees use won't have a key available, but I also give those higher DCs unless oil is applied first.Unfortunately they didn't make it much of a meaningful choice, but rather the option of last resort. Using Thieves Tools should always be the designed ideal option, as it costs no resources and has minimal consequence (unless you failed to notice a trap). Knock has the resource cost of a 2nd level spell slot, so while you'll always succeed, you're paying for it. With the 5E &quot;ringing the dinner bell&quot; mechanic, you're paying a resource and suffering a consequence for using it. The only time it's useful is when you don't have the time to break down the door, or for whatever reason the door is nigh unbreakable. IMO they should have either left off the &quot;dinner bell&quot; mechanic or they should have made it a ritual.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Shiroiken, post: 8806227, member: 6775477"] Whenever I have a lock that gets used, I always write where the key is found (usually who's carrying it). My players look for keys, because they know [I]someone[/I] must have them. Of course, I thew them for a loop once against a master thief, who destroyed the key and just picked it each time. Obviously an old lock that never sees use won't have a key available, but I also give those higher DCs unless oil is applied first. Unfortunately they didn't make it much of a meaningful choice, but rather the option of last resort. Using Thieves Tools should always be the designed ideal option, as it costs no resources and has minimal consequence (unless you failed to notice a trap). Knock has the resource cost of a 2nd level spell slot, so while you'll always succeed, you're paying for it. With the 5E "ringing the dinner bell" mechanic, you're paying a resource [I]and[/I] suffering a consequence for using it. The only time it's useful is when you don't have the time to break down the door, or for whatever reason the door is nigh unbreakable. IMO they should have either left off the "dinner bell" mechanic or they should have made it a ritual. [/QUOTE]

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