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How Badly Do Randomly Rolled Stats Affect 4E Math?
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<blockquote data-quote="jbear" data-source="post: 5211935" data-attributes="member: 75065"><p>Don't know if this helps, but I'll share my experience of our game from levels 1-6.</p><p> </p><p>All my players receive +7 points to distribute on stats; two of the most common combinations are 18 16 12 12 10 8 or 16 16 16 12 10 8 before racials (and off the top of my head without working out if I'm a point or two off). Which, if you were rolling, I think most people would be pretty okay with. Then again you might be doing a roll 4d6, drop the lowest, reroll 1s and you can make 12 characters and choose the best, so I can't say...</p><p> </p><p>I also have allowed them to choose 2 backgrounds; one that ensures their highest stat determines HP and another that relates to their prefered skill boost.</p><p> </p><p>As far as feats and powers, I help them all choose very tight optimal choices that synergise with one another. I don't have access to the books in Spanish so it is very difficult for my players to do this for themselves.</p><p> </p><p>I have also awarded them Versatile Expertise at level 5 as an in-game boon which has far reaching consequences plot-wise.</p><p> </p><p>So they are all well over par charcters.</p><p> </p><p>As far as treasure: I follow the guidelines as per the DMG; often treasure is missed by lack luster searching on the part of the players. This is balanced by the fact each has a customised magic item that each player has 'invented' with my approval and has begun to slowly awaken. This was a bribe I offered my players as the condition was they had to develop their backstories and tie the object into their past, giving me a reason why the innate power was only beginning to awaken now (providing me with loads of story hooks for future adventures)</p><p> </p><p>My experiences in so far as game play:</p><p> </p><p>-Their accuracy is very very high; any use of lower level creatures in an encounter means some of them are hitting on a roll of 3. </p><p> </p><p>- In a one encounter per day type situation they can take anything down.</p><p> </p><p>- They have been able to stand up to some very nasty encounters of +6 above their level which included very challenging terrain that put them at a serious tactical disadvantage.</p><p> </p><p>-However there have been 4 near deaths. When I say near, I mean very near. In fact I had to allow one of the players to improvise with a 'Do Something Cool' Homebrew Encounter power to alter her Daily Utility 'Back from Death's Door' to save another player's life who had been brutalised into negatives past her bloodied value. If I had of played by the rules, she was dead, done and gone. </p><p> </p><p>-The PCs are still vulnerable to normal level encounters but you have to make the situation itself challenging, as the monsters in a straight fight will be a cakewalk. However PCs in a boat trying to be tipped out by aquatic zombies in crocodile infested swampwater is still challenging and fun where as 5 same level zombies in a room with a table and 4 chairs is not. This is true even for normal PCs and even more so for Super PCs.</p><p> </p><p>-Also my PCs are challenged by situations where it is difficult/impossible/against the pcs interests to take an extended rest. The current day in my game has seen 6 encounters so far and during the 6th they have unfortunately triggered a 7th and an 8th by some very unfortunate decision making. Healing Surges are seriously low, despite the fact that all the encounters of the current day have been of same level or +1 (maybe one of them was a +2 encounter); After 6 encounters losing one or two healing surges per encounter becomes a serious problem if time is of the essence and you need to push on.</p><p> </p><p>-As for setting off two encounters (both of their level) at once before being able to rest from the last ... well, to be honest I fear for their lives. That is where we left the last game session. I really have no idea if they will be wise and find a way to survive.</p><p> </p><p>So I think that the length of the adventuring day (at least at heroic levels) seriously adds to the challenge even for super heroic heroes. As does combining encounters. </p><p>You will need to make the encounter in itself challenging and interesting, as opposed to just relying on monsters and xp buy to create challenging encounters. </p><p>Also you can make the out of combat stuff more challenging, having their decisions make a greater impact on the game/ the world they live in. </p><p>One of the last skill challenges I designed was quite deadly, during which one of the PCs nearly died. It was a very memorable moment. </p><p>You make the challenge, not the monsters; they are just a few of many tools you can use. And of course they are best used in tandem with your other tools as well. Be creative. Push them and see how much they can take... but not all the time, every encounter, one after the other. Sometimes they should be an unstoppable, untouchable force ... that makes encounters where they are not so untouchable a lot scarier.</p><p> </p><p>I hope you can glean something useful from this.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="jbear, post: 5211935, member: 75065"] Don't know if this helps, but I'll share my experience of our game from levels 1-6. All my players receive +7 points to distribute on stats; two of the most common combinations are 18 16 12 12 10 8 or 16 16 16 12 10 8 before racials (and off the top of my head without working out if I'm a point or two off). Which, if you were rolling, I think most people would be pretty okay with. Then again you might be doing a roll 4d6, drop the lowest, reroll 1s and you can make 12 characters and choose the best, so I can't say... I also have allowed them to choose 2 backgrounds; one that ensures their highest stat determines HP and another that relates to their prefered skill boost. As far as feats and powers, I help them all choose very tight optimal choices that synergise with one another. I don't have access to the books in Spanish so it is very difficult for my players to do this for themselves. I have also awarded them Versatile Expertise at level 5 as an in-game boon which has far reaching consequences plot-wise. So they are all well over par charcters. As far as treasure: I follow the guidelines as per the DMG; often treasure is missed by lack luster searching on the part of the players. This is balanced by the fact each has a customised magic item that each player has 'invented' with my approval and has begun to slowly awaken. This was a bribe I offered my players as the condition was they had to develop their backstories and tie the object into their past, giving me a reason why the innate power was only beginning to awaken now (providing me with loads of story hooks for future adventures) My experiences in so far as game play: -Their accuracy is very very high; any use of lower level creatures in an encounter means some of them are hitting on a roll of 3. - In a one encounter per day type situation they can take anything down. - They have been able to stand up to some very nasty encounters of +6 above their level which included very challenging terrain that put them at a serious tactical disadvantage. -However there have been 4 near deaths. When I say near, I mean very near. In fact I had to allow one of the players to improvise with a 'Do Something Cool' Homebrew Encounter power to alter her Daily Utility 'Back from Death's Door' to save another player's life who had been brutalised into negatives past her bloodied value. If I had of played by the rules, she was dead, done and gone. -The PCs are still vulnerable to normal level encounters but you have to make the situation itself challenging, as the monsters in a straight fight will be a cakewalk. However PCs in a boat trying to be tipped out by aquatic zombies in crocodile infested swampwater is still challenging and fun where as 5 same level zombies in a room with a table and 4 chairs is not. This is true even for normal PCs and even more so for Super PCs. -Also my PCs are challenged by situations where it is difficult/impossible/against the pcs interests to take an extended rest. The current day in my game has seen 6 encounters so far and during the 6th they have unfortunately triggered a 7th and an 8th by some very unfortunate decision making. Healing Surges are seriously low, despite the fact that all the encounters of the current day have been of same level or +1 (maybe one of them was a +2 encounter); After 6 encounters losing one or two healing surges per encounter becomes a serious problem if time is of the essence and you need to push on. -As for setting off two encounters (both of their level) at once before being able to rest from the last ... well, to be honest I fear for their lives. That is where we left the last game session. I really have no idea if they will be wise and find a way to survive. So I think that the length of the adventuring day (at least at heroic levels) seriously adds to the challenge even for super heroic heroes. As does combining encounters. You will need to make the encounter in itself challenging and interesting, as opposed to just relying on monsters and xp buy to create challenging encounters. Also you can make the out of combat stuff more challenging, having their decisions make a greater impact on the game/ the world they live in. One of the last skill challenges I designed was quite deadly, during which one of the PCs nearly died. It was a very memorable moment. You make the challenge, not the monsters; they are just a few of many tools you can use. And of course they are best used in tandem with your other tools as well. Be creative. Push them and see how much they can take... but not all the time, every encounter, one after the other. Sometimes they should be an unstoppable, untouchable force ... that makes encounters where they are not so untouchable a lot scarier. I hope you can glean something useful from this. [/QUOTE]
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