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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Cergorach" data-source="post: 9763258" data-attributes="member: 725">I'm currently DMing Undermountain, I use (passive) perception to find secret doors, investigation to actually open them. Theoretically they could use strength to open the door, but as most secret doors are stone, they would need a hammer or portable ram to do that... Not to mention the noise. I did warn the players very strongly that no stat is a dumpstat in this game and they might regret taking dumpstats (besides secret doors, we also have a LOT of brain puppies).But if you want to use charisma, start treating the dungeon as a living entity, start talking to it. Treat it like a friend, give it a nice pet occasionally, clean up the messes you and others make, and maybe pry it's secrets loose... Whether that works or not, really depends on your DM and what kind of game they are trying to run. In our campaign this might actually work eventually, because of... Reasons...  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f608.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":devilish:" title="Devil    :devilish:"  data-smilie="29"data-shortname=":devilish:" /></blockquote>