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<blockquote data-quote="Mistwell" data-source="post: 6281497" data-attributes="member: 2525">Why? I'm not sure it would matter, and I think it would be fine.It's not &quot;immune to fireballs&quot;.&nbsp; And before I continue to explain the difference, which you almost certainly already know, can we start this conversation agreeing to no strawmanning and hyperbole like that?A Dexterity save vs. a fireball attack is an attempt to REDUCE the damage from DODGING.&nbsp; None of that, in any edition of D&amp;D, implies immunity to a fireball.&nbsp; Now if they have another ability that reduced it further to zero, that's an issue with the other ability (which I think is also a dodging ability, not an immunity).&nbsp; The rogue is already equally skilled at similar dodging.&nbsp; For example, if they make a balance check to dodge falling rocks while climbing, it's not asking if they are immune to falling rocks, it's asking if they effectively dodged them.Naw, I think it would be fine for it to apply to saves.&nbsp; They're proficient in Dexterity checks (that's all), so giving them Reliable Talent with Dexterity Saves doesn't seem to change the game much anyway.Do they say a tool use is an ability check? More importantly, this isn't a rules interpretation argument I am making, it's a &quot;how should they do this in the final rules&quot; argument.&nbsp; And I am arguing they should simply fold saves into checks, because they're already essentially checks.It won't cause any confusion if they simply change the language to all be a Dexterity Check, or Save if you are proficient in that Save.&nbsp; It's the same language as any other check then.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Mistwell, post: 6281497, member: 2525"] Why? I'm not sure it would matter, and I think it would be fine. It's not "immune to fireballs". And before I continue to explain the difference, which you almost certainly already know, can we start this conversation agreeing to no strawmanning and hyperbole like that? A Dexterity save vs. a fireball attack is an attempt to REDUCE the damage from DODGING. None of that, in any edition of D&D, implies immunity to a fireball. Now if they have another ability that reduced it further to zero, that's an issue with the other ability (which I think is also a dodging ability, not an immunity). The rogue is already equally skilled at similar dodging. For example, if they make a balance check to dodge falling rocks while climbing, it's not asking if they are immune to falling rocks, it's asking if they effectively dodged them. Naw, I think it would be fine for it to apply to saves. They're proficient in Dexterity checks (that's all), so giving them Reliable Talent with Dexterity Saves doesn't seem to change the game much anyway. Do they say a tool use is an ability check? More importantly, this isn't a rules interpretation argument I am making, it's a "how should they do this in the final rules" argument. And I am arguing they should simply fold saves into checks, because they're already essentially checks. It won't cause any confusion if they simply change the language to all be a Dexterity Check, or Save if you are proficient in that Save. It's the same language as any other check then. [/QUOTE]

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