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<blockquote data-quote="Sunseeker" data-source="post: 7424605">Then, I might suggest, structuring it more &quot;Indiana Jones&quot; style, less &quot;kill the Nazis&quot; and more &quot;discover cool stuff in ancient ruins&quot;.&nbsp; You both gain wealth (from what you find and what you find that you sell later) and you go on adventures, and ostensibly you don't need a driving &quot;evil&quot; force.&nbsp; The ruins could be inhabited by ghosts or skeletons or plant monsters.&nbsp; You still maintain that motivation of wealth, but you open up the motivations of &quot;defeating evil&quot;.&nbsp; Maybe the party runs into another adventuring party, with whom they have to compete, and that party is evil, so the Player Party doesn't initially set out to defeat evil (remember the Hobbits only initially set out to get The Ring to Rivendell) but once they encounter the Evil Party and find out from clues or interrogation that the Evil Party means to use the McGuffin in the ruins to start the Thousand Years of Darkness*, now the Player Party has a motivation to fight evil.&nbsp; *The Thousand Years of Darkness will of course, kill everything they love and so on.Usually when players encounter a case of &quot;Everything We Do Makes it Worse!&quot; what you've really encountered is a DM who thinks they're clever, but really just isn't translating their ideas well to the players.&nbsp; It's easy for a DM to think &quot;Why aren't they getting this?&quot; because to the DM, it's all clear as day in the DM's head.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Sunseeker, post: 7424605"] Then, I might suggest, structuring it more "Indiana Jones" style, less "kill the Nazis" and more "discover cool stuff in ancient ruins". You both gain wealth (from what you find and what you find that you sell later) and you go on adventures, and ostensibly you don't need a driving "evil" force. The ruins could be inhabited by ghosts or skeletons or plant monsters. You still maintain that motivation of wealth, but you open up the motivations of "defeating evil". Maybe the party runs into another adventuring party, with whom they have to compete, and that party is evil, so the Player Party doesn't [I]initially[/I] set out to defeat evil (remember the Hobbits only initially set out to get The Ring to Rivendell) but once they encounter the Evil Party and find out from clues or interrogation that the Evil Party means to use the McGuffin in the ruins to start the Thousand Years of Darkness*, [I]now[/I] the Player Party has a motivation to fight evil. *The Thousand Years of Darkness will of course, kill everything they love and so on. Usually when players encounter a case of "Everything We Do Makes it Worse!" what you've really encountered is a DM who thinks they're clever, but really just isn't translating their ideas well to the players. It's easy for a DM to think "Why aren't they getting this?" because to the DM, it's all clear as day in the DM's head. [/QUOTE]

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