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General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
How do Governments Align?
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<blockquote data-quote="zabom" data-source="post: 6792814" data-attributes="member: 6807118"><p>The evil involved lies in the act of using unfair leverage against the employee not within the selfishness of the businessman. While his selfishness is the motive behind his evil acts, we cannot come to the false conclusion that a motive is or can be evil. For if we do so, than we must conclude that all motives to do evil are evil. In that case love is evil because men have murdered for love. Freedom must be evil because wars have been fought for freedom. In this case the businessman's dishonesty is the evil and let's not also forget that if the shoe were on the other foot and the businessman was bound by the leverage of an over-reaching union that demanded unrealistic wages without ensuring employee productivity, no one would be screaming about the selfishness of the employee. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Valid, however D&D rules designate alignment to the individual not to governments, so we are already stepping outside of those rules with this discussion.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>This is actually the thought process that is so detrimental to freedom. I do not know what country you come from, but I am from the US. Our government was founded on the beliefs that government's sole purpose is to protect the rights of the people. It was later that people of a more socialist mentality decided that government should see to the needs of the people. The problem, is that when government sees to the needs of the people, people become dependent on the government for those needs. This is the core statement of my argument that I want you to think about -Freedom without independence is an illusion.- Let that sink in for a minute. When you live under your parents roof are you truly free? No, because you must conform to their rules no matter how unfair you think them to be, because you are dependent on them. Let me describe a situation to you and after I am done I will tell you what I have described. As you read it ask yourself if it sounds good. You have all of the food you need to live supplied. You have a roof over your head at no charge, and are given free medical care. You are expected to do your fair share of work, but you can not be fired no matter how inept you are at your job. All of your needs are met and all you have to do is obey the rules of those that supply them. What I just described is slavery. Granted I didn't mention the beatings, murders, rapes and unsanitary living conditions, but neither will a government that promises to supply all your needs until they have you completely dependent. Once again, freedom without independence is an illusion. Now lets look at how things work when the government is more interested in protecting rights. You have the right to seek fair compensation for your work. You have the right to be paid more if you work more. You have the right to quit if the employer is unfair. You have the right to grow your own food, collect your own water, and hunt and fish for your own meat. You have the right to create and build your own business and to keep the fruits of your labor. This system actually worked in the US until the government started playing with and regulating the economy. People are quick to say that government economic intervention was necessary to get us out of the depression, but they forget that it was the governments choice to step away from the gold standard and print, for the first time, $500,000,000 without gold backing that led to the stock market crash in the first place. The sudden inflation that resulted caused every item that had been sold on credit to be worth more than the amount owed. Businesses were forced to take the loss and the subsequent stock market crash caused the depression that the government then stood up and took action to "save" the "failed capitalist economy." Laissez-faire capitalism works if you let it, and if the government remains focused on the rights of the people to supply their own needs. It is when the government tries to supply those needs itself that capitalism fails, not because capitalism is flawed but because it cannot work in an impure semi-socialist state.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="zabom, post: 6792814, member: 6807118"] The evil involved lies in the act of using unfair leverage against the employee not within the selfishness of the businessman. While his selfishness is the motive behind his evil acts, we cannot come to the false conclusion that a motive is or can be evil. For if we do so, than we must conclude that all motives to do evil are evil. In that case love is evil because men have murdered for love. Freedom must be evil because wars have been fought for freedom. In this case the businessman's dishonesty is the evil and let's not also forget that if the shoe were on the other foot and the businessman was bound by the leverage of an over-reaching union that demanded unrealistic wages without ensuring employee productivity, no one would be screaming about the selfishness of the employee. Valid, however D&D rules designate alignment to the individual not to governments, so we are already stepping outside of those rules with this discussion. This is actually the thought process that is so detrimental to freedom. I do not know what country you come from, but I am from the US. Our government was founded on the beliefs that government's sole purpose is to protect the rights of the people. It was later that people of a more socialist mentality decided that government should see to the needs of the people. The problem, is that when government sees to the needs of the people, people become dependent on the government for those needs. This is the core statement of my argument that I want you to think about -Freedom without independence is an illusion.- Let that sink in for a minute. When you live under your parents roof are you truly free? No, because you must conform to their rules no matter how unfair you think them to be, because you are dependent on them. Let me describe a situation to you and after I am done I will tell you what I have described. As you read it ask yourself if it sounds good. You have all of the food you need to live supplied. You have a roof over your head at no charge, and are given free medical care. You are expected to do your fair share of work, but you can not be fired no matter how inept you are at your job. All of your needs are met and all you have to do is obey the rules of those that supply them. What I just described is slavery. Granted I didn't mention the beatings, murders, rapes and unsanitary living conditions, but neither will a government that promises to supply all your needs until they have you completely dependent. Once again, freedom without independence is an illusion. Now lets look at how things work when the government is more interested in protecting rights. You have the right to seek fair compensation for your work. You have the right to be paid more if you work more. You have the right to quit if the employer is unfair. You have the right to grow your own food, collect your own water, and hunt and fish for your own meat. You have the right to create and build your own business and to keep the fruits of your labor. This system actually worked in the US until the government started playing with and regulating the economy. People are quick to say that government economic intervention was necessary to get us out of the depression, but they forget that it was the governments choice to step away from the gold standard and print, for the first time, $500,000,000 without gold backing that led to the stock market crash in the first place. The sudden inflation that resulted caused every item that had been sold on credit to be worth more than the amount owed. Businesses were forced to take the loss and the subsequent stock market crash caused the depression that the government then stood up and took action to "save" the "failed capitalist economy." Laissez-faire capitalism works if you let it, and if the government remains focused on the rights of the people to supply their own needs. It is when the government tries to supply those needs itself that capitalism fails, not because capitalism is flawed but because it cannot work in an impure semi-socialist state. [/QUOTE]
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