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Message: <blockquote data-quote="roguish" data-source="post: 9501170" data-attributes="member: 7046843">I only meant I did not agree that advantage does not apply WHEN you roll sleight of hand with thieves' tools, and have proficiency in both. I think that by the rules it does apply. Of course, the bigger question is: if you're not a Thief using Fast Hands, DO you roll sleight of hand? Or just dexterity? Nobody knows! The books don't say, therefore we're left with the Tools section, that we KNOW doesn't give complete instructions. It's a mess, and for the DMG's traps it's a moot question anyway: thieves' tools don't come into play at all. Does it matter if you would roll dexterity or sleight of hand, with advantage or without, when you don't get to roll at all?I wanna make it very very clear that, whether we agree or not, this isn't on us. We're trying to make head or tales of incomplete rules. This is on them.As for whether the advantage (and generally mixing skills with tools) is a good rule, I'm still ambivalent, but you're making very good points. I'll have to think about DCs before making up my mind, another thing 5e didn't grace us with. Because at the end of the day, whatever the formula of rolling is, the goal is to produce a probability of success that makes sense, depending on the character's abilities and the situation.Who cares? Houseruling is free. There's exactly one group of people that has to accept the changes we make, and it's the group we're playing with. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /></blockquote>

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