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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Vegepygmy" data-source="post: 4734214" data-attributes="member: 40109">Same here.  I think it's because I cut my gaming teeth on 1e (AD&D), where no such concept existed, and DMs had to develop a certain instinct for what constitutes an appropriate challenge. But here's the really interesting thing I've noticed: some of my players who began with 3E and have only experienced the game with a CR system will actually calculate the CR of an encounter in the middle of the encounter, and if it's "too high," they'll start complaining about the inevitable TPK that's coming, even though they're winning the fight.  They're so sure they can't win, in fact, that they start looking for escape routes, or going on total defense when they should be full attacking...and it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy! I think I hate the concept of challenge ratings (in any edition).</blockquote>