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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Majoru Oakheart" data-source="post: 4734291" data-attributes="member: 5143">I've seen this happen as well.  Then again, I've seen a DM who threw out the CR system entirely and threw an EL 28 or so encounter against us while we were 7th level.  We were massacred.  We all saw it coming, but there was nothing we could do.  He thought it was a valid challenge.The problem was that CR wasn't accurate enough and power varied too drastically from character to character.  A group of really power gamed characters with good equipment could fight 2 monsters who were BOTH CR=(Average Party level)+4 with not much of a problem at all.  Even though that is officially an EL+APL+6 Encounter, which means it should TPK all groups without fail.On the other hand, the XP system from 4e is much, much more accurate.  Throw a group of 5 level 6 monsters up against level 1 characters and you can pretty much guarantee a TPK.</blockquote>