Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Rocket your D&D 5E and Level Up: Advanced 5E games into space! Alpha Star Magazine Is Launching... Right Now!

Reply to thread

Message: <blockquote data-quote="Tovec" data-source="post: 5897912" data-attributes="member: 95493">I think you just hit on another major issue we "dislikers" have. He has a head wound, he is stalking and grim...... None of which is displayed in the rules or actions of the character. Yes recovering 1/4 (assuming you are near 0 in the first place) puts you into your bloodied condition but otherwise you are able to act just as freely and normally as anything. The bloodied condition does little to remedy this in general terms but after shrugging off the most recent injuries and going back into the fray it looks even more silly.The objection isn't that we think the wounds are just disappearing. The problem is that they act as though the wounds do not exist. This is a small but critical distinction. Using the boxing example (from the <a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/d-d-4th-edition-discussion/291256-hit-points-healing-surges-101-a.html" target="_blank">link</a>), it isn't that he gets back up and continues fighting. It is that he does so while considered more or less as fit as if he hadn't been knocked down in the first place. It doesn't matter if he has 1/4 HP after getting back up or 1/4 HP before getting knocked down in the first place - except where the Healing Surges tally ranks. What if you don't want to be the "epic" heroes. Kind of hard to remove the system when it is engrained. There are any number of ways of adding it in for those who want it but there are no good and simple ways of taking it out.You seem to be assuming the 26% who said "okay idea but.." fall in with the ranks of the "Like" side as opposed  to being neutral. If they meant HS to be a good idea they could have  voted that way. If they meant them to be a bad idea they could have  voted that way too.Since we can't say for certain exactly where all the "Idea was okay"  votes should go if the option was removed, we should exclude the neutral 26% entirely. What is left over is the 44% saying "Dislike" and 29%  saying "Like", and 1.5% saying "I don't care". I think you should look at those numbers instead. Just  saying.Put another way, comparing JUST the Like/Dislike figures - 60% Dislike, 40% Like. That seems to be about right as far as figures on this issue go. Some people do like the surges, some don't. There is no sense forcing the surges (in any form) on those who don't like it as it will only serve to alienate them further. What is better is to provide an option where healing surges can be used by the 40% and discarded by the 60%.As Wiseblood keeps saying, but I'll put another way. As Wiseblood DOES say, they are not a good example - they are a Strawman.A. CLW wands were not free. They weren't expensive by higher levels but they weren't FREE.B. CLW wands didn't heal 1/4 HP. They healed 1d8+1 (iirc). If you are higher level, they still heal 1d8+1.C. Not everyone can use CLW wands - clerics certainly can, but UMD users required a roll which they may fail.D. CLW wands are AT BEST an out of combat solution only.E. You still had to buy and ensure you had the wand available, not just simply "feel better".F. Removing CLW (or increasing the price) fixes the problem. No more CLW wands and the "free healing" arugment against 3e goes away. As others have pointed out, you can't remove HS and Second Wind so easily.G. Also, this is clearly a strawman example. Yes CLW wands can be done, but it isn't the norm, it is the exception. Power-gamers or those looking to exploit the system can grab the wand but the average group doesn't or at least doesn't acquire them in the quantities which seems to be necessary for the myth to arise around these boards.H. I can easily remove clerics (or normal, traditional healers) from a group and replace them with other things. It is certainly not the issue that is thought to be fixed exclusively by 4e. Yes having a cleric helps but no group I have played with has ever felt FORCED to play the cleric.</blockquote>

Verification