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Message: <blockquote data-quote="javcs" data-source="post: 4597288" data-attributes="member: 43677">Did you even READ what they wrote?Because, as non-skill-monkey classes go, what was presented was a decently skilled (in general) paladin.How are you defining 'Decently skilled'? Because someone who isn't a dedicated skill-monkey build in a high-skill class should have fewer skill points than someone who is a dedicated skill-monkey build in a high-skill class.Decently skilled ... let's see, I'd call that having at least average skill points/level.The average number of base skill points per level for the core PC classes is 3.8181818181818181818181818181818, plus Int of course, so the 4+Int as presented by StreamOfTheSky is above average. The average with non-core classes depends on just which supplements are allowed.You want a highly skilled paladin? Take enough rogue levels to qualify for Shadowbane Stalker. And/or use the tricks presented above/on previous pages.I believe that there's another PRC that's similar, but I haven't personally perused it, so I don't know for sure.But taking a pure paladin that isn't properly built for a high amount of skill points, and then saying that a the system is broken because you can't get a lot of skills with that build? That's analogous to saying the system is broken because as a rogue that is built improperly for having lots of HP, I can't get as many HP as a fighter/paladin/barbarian. As for the original topic ... random number generators are quite effective at solving the problem of making rolls.When I DM, I require that players give me their modifiers and stat breakdowns for a short list of things and keep me updated whenever they improve. I generally require ACs, Spot, Listen, Sense Motive, Search, Saves, Special Senses, and Resistances/Immunities. If it's not on my list, they don't get the benefits of their abilities on anything that I roll for them. Having the list lets me check for things without alerting the players to anything, and if it's a Spot/Listen/Sense Motive/other senses check and a character succeeds, I pull the player aside, and give them the information that the check allows them privately - what they do with that info is then up to them.I highly recommend that all my fellow GMs do something similar. Either that, or randomly call for checks from the players at 1d4 minute intervals, unless something more important is going on than a random check.</blockquote>

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