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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Oghma" data-source="post: 1850563" data-attributes="member: 71">I've been in several campaigns with cheaters over the years, and it's been dealt with in different ways.I had a player repeatedly fudge die rolls in a pivotal battle.  The whole group noticed it, because he'd roll them in a box and not show them to any one, except once in a while when he actually rolled well.  As the DM, I retired that character (who the player really liked), and made him make a new one that came in 2 levels lower than the rest of the party.  I explained to him that he had messed with the "reality" of the world, and his former character was now "not real".We also had a player in one of my high school groups who rolled amazing characters up every time, and played them in his own campaigns with other players.  Then he'd bring them into the group's "shared" campaign and use them.  The group killed his character in-character.   He got the point.I always think the best way to show someone the error of their ways is to take away the motive they used to do it.  Why did he do it?  To have a kick ass PC?  Take away the PC in a creative way.  Did he do it to appear to excel in the group's eyes, to gain prestige?  Take away that prestige, humiliate him or his character.  Is he trying to "win"?  Then he has to lose, in whatever way is most galling to him.Is he a know-it-all?  Take away what he studied so hard to do.  Any thing he can use to his advantage is suddenly exactly to his disadvantage. When he catches on, change things back, so he is stymied again.I know this sounds a bit harsh, almost manipulative.  Consequences are important.  If there are no consequences to bad actions, then those bad actions will repeat.If he did it to fix something in him that is broken, an emotional/self esteem issue, then you have to tread more carefully. That requires a one-on-one with the player and some careful listening and talking.You mentioned that the group seems to know what's going on.  It may be that they will take the matter into their own hands. As a player, I get irritated when someone messes with my reality, even when my character benefits.  It's not "real", then.  It's cheating.  I would rather die honestly than win by cheating.People forget, sometimes, that the game isn't about winning.  It's about the story.  Spectacular failures in a campaign introduce another kind of obstacle to overcome, another way to rise to the occasion.  Any fantasy story you ever read has failure in it.  Botching a roll is just part of the story.  The roll-fakers forget this, sometimes.Well, good luck.  This is a hard one.</blockquote>

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