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<blockquote data-quote="Rya.Reisender" data-source="post: 7354633" data-attributes="member: 6801585">Okay, so let me collect my thoughts on this. So I think that this &quot;Surprise&quot; ability is something that happens very rarely. Normally it requires ALL party members to succeed their stealth roll, plus the rogue rolling higher initiative than the enemy.So yeah I see that the rogue could be like &quot;Well then, I go ahead and play separate from the others.&quot;Anyway, what I personally do here is the following:1. I tell my players that they can only hide from something if they know it's there. So during normal gameplay there isn't any reason to split up at all.2. This is mostly depending on context, but combat could happen in three ways. The group gets surprised by something they haven't been aware. Two opposing groups run directly into each other without being aware of each others presence, so nobody gets a chance to surprise. And finally, the I tell the adventurers about a threat they notice and ask them how they want to proceed. Only in this last case, surprise matters at all.3. So for the case the adventurers are a aware of a threat: What I personally allow is that my players can opt to stay out of combat the first round. If they opt out, they don't need to do a stealth roll (they basically automatically succeed), but in exchange are also not allowed to do any offensive actions in round 1. At the end of round 1 they can get in position and join battle for round 2.This allows for a lot of versatility, but the rogue never has to go lone wolf mode. In fact in my group it's usually not only the rogue going alone but depending on situation, others want to try surprise as well. Sometimes only the ones in heavy armor pass. Sometimes they don't even try to be stealthy because it seems more reasonable to have the tank charge in first.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Rya.Reisender, post: 7354633, member: 6801585"] Okay, so let me collect my thoughts on this. So I think that this "Surprise" ability is something that happens very rarely. Normally it requires ALL party members to succeed their stealth roll, plus the rogue rolling higher initiative than the enemy. So yeah I see that the rogue could be like "Well then, I go ahead and play separate from the others." Anyway, what I personally do here is the following: 1. I tell my players that they can only hide from something if they know it's there. So during normal gameplay there isn't any reason to split up at all. 2. This is mostly depending on context, but combat could happen in three ways. The group gets surprised by something they haven't been aware. Two opposing groups run directly into each other without being aware of each others presence, so nobody gets a chance to surprise. And finally, the I tell the adventurers about a threat they notice and ask them how they want to proceed. Only in this last case, surprise matters at all. 3. So for the case the adventurers are a aware of a threat: What I personally allow is that my players can opt to stay out of combat the first round. If they opt out, they don't need to do a stealth roll (they basically automatically succeed), but in exchange are also not allowed to do any offensive actions in round 1. At the end of round 1 they can get in position and join battle for round 2. This allows for a lot of versatility, but the rogue never has to go lone wolf mode. In fact in my group it's usually not only the rogue going alone but depending on situation, others want to try surprise as well. Sometimes only the ones in heavy armor pass. Sometimes they don't even try to be stealthy because it seems more reasonable to have the tank charge in first. [/QUOTE]

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