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Message: <blockquote data-quote="bert1000" data-source="post: 4687291" data-attributes="member: 29013">I think you can run skill challenges effectively with both a more explicit and less explicit method (I prefer less explicit, except in goal setting). However, I think the big innovation that can be brought about by skill challenges is to explicitly give players and GMs a different level of game play. Most of the D&D games I used to play in the 80s/90s used 2 methods to run non-combat encounters: 1) player description (micro and macro) with DM fiat to determine results2) micro-level description and dice rolling, DM fiat to determine ultimate success/end of effort for mutiple linked actions Although not invented by the 4e skill challenge, it highlights another level of game play maybe as not widely used by the D&D crowd: 3) the abstracted scene with character abilities determining a portion of success/failure and a pre-determined success mechanic If players realize that #3 is available to them, then you get another viable option for action resolution, which is always a good thing for me. Some examples: The players are trying to get out of a cave after a cave-in in order to pursue a villain that escaped. Method #2 might involve very specific "1 round" type actions spelled out by the player (e.g., I try to move some of the rubble in the NW corner") and some dice rolling to determine if that specific action succeeds or not.  All of these specific actions would determine success and the DM has a lot of control on when to stop asking for actions. Method #3 allows the players to state "We going to try and get out of this cave as quickly as possible so we can catch the villain".  Now, this creates a more abstract scene of linked actions (although with a clear goal).  Each action can represent rounds, minutes, days, etc. as fitting the scene. If players really get the advantages and disadvantages of method #3, then they can help initiate the most fun vehicle to resolve the action.  For instance, say a party is riding with a caravan of farmers and a group of brigands blocks the way.  Instead of starting off with a micro action, the players could say "We’re going to try and talk the brigands into leaving us alone (goal).  First, as I approach the leader, I make sure to brush my cloak aside and reveal my scabbard with the Duke's coat of arms (intimidate check)..." Players begin to think about linked actions toward a common goal, and beyond 1-round micro actions to the concept of a "scene".     </blockquote>

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