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How do you rule on NPC-to-PC social interactions?
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<blockquote data-quote="MostlyHarmless42" data-source="post: 8482258" data-attributes="member: 6845520"><p>The thing about rules though, they <em>are</em> a useful metric and tool for keeping the game running balanced and fair with at least some sort of stakes being possible. The rules are there to make it so one a## of a player doesn't just go "I just poke the dragon and make it's head explode and then go home and build a castle with nothing but my left foot and a pile of string." Beer and pretzels Monty python-esque silly games with zero stakes can be fun and all but some people actually <em>do</em> enjoy a game with a more grounded/serious tone and the challenge of worldbuilding limitations and logical consistency. That fictional castle for them feels better if it's earned through blood, sweat, and tears even if they are also [hopefully] fictional. I for one enjoy a moderation of all extremes, but the point is the rules are good at facilitating these sorts of things.</p><p></p><p>More relevant to your ongoing conversation, I do agree largely with you, roleplaying is important and we should <em>never</em> limit player agency. However I do point out the issue with relying too much on sheer roleplaying... not every person is a Shakespearean level actor, and should not be expected to be in order to play the game (especially as a high charisma character). This is especially true if you have players or a DM that is in anyway neurodivergant. Social anxiety and autism are both far more common in the hobby than people think, just as couple examples, and in some cases it may be difficult for certain players to speak well or confidently. There is a reason we don't ask people to bench press the couch on every strength check. Not to mention with deception in particular it is sort of an awkward thing; I don't tend to spend large portions of my limited free time willingly associating with those who tend to be good and habitual liars. Strange standards to have I know.</p><p></p><p>In terms of actual mechanics as a DM I typically just ask a player what their intentions are if I suspect they are trying to pull some sort of lie in character or are having trouble expressing what they are going for. It is not a good goal for players to try and outwit or surprise their DM, and a quick check with the player out of character as to what they are trying to do really helps for determining which checks to call for.</p><p></p><p>That all said...while player agency is paramount, I should clarify that as a DM I don't <em>ever</em> roll a deception check for an NPC to lie unless I hear the phrase "Can I check to see if they is lying?" Or something similar. I can and frequently do give my players false info mixed in with the truth often to hilarious consequences. But my players have all been told this we we started the game, and I carefully consider what each NPC's motivations are and what knowledge they do or do not possess. Using an example you had, if someone actually <em>did</em> believe they saw aliens flying over town I'd just have the NPC say it, then the players are free to ask if they think he's telling the truth or not. Our table tends to interpret a good insight rolls as "You get the feeling he either genuinely believes he saw aliens or he is a hell of a good liar." </p><p></p><p>I deliberately leave it open and vague for the players to interpret which answer is the one they wish to pick their character to believe. I do this consistently because when I <em>do</em> have NPCs that are genuinely good liars it means I can actually get away with false information if a rolled deception check is good.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="MostlyHarmless42, post: 8482258, member: 6845520"] The thing about rules though, they [I]are[/I] a useful metric and tool for keeping the game running balanced and fair with at least some sort of stakes being possible. The rules are there to make it so one a## of a player doesn't just go "I just poke the dragon and make it's head explode and then go home and build a castle with nothing but my left foot and a pile of string." Beer and pretzels Monty python-esque silly games with zero stakes can be fun and all but some people actually [I]do[/I] enjoy a game with a more grounded/serious tone and the challenge of worldbuilding limitations and logical consistency. That fictional castle for them feels better if it's earned through blood, sweat, and tears even if they are also [hopefully] fictional. I for one enjoy a moderation of all extremes, but the point is the rules are good at facilitating these sorts of things. More relevant to your ongoing conversation, I do agree largely with you, roleplaying is important and we should [I]never[/I] limit player agency. However I do point out the issue with relying too much on sheer roleplaying... not every person is a Shakespearean level actor, and should not be expected to be in order to play the game (especially as a high charisma character). This is especially true if you have players or a DM that is in anyway neurodivergant. Social anxiety and autism are both far more common in the hobby than people think, just as couple examples, and in some cases it may be difficult for certain players to speak well or confidently. There is a reason we don't ask people to bench press the couch on every strength check. Not to mention with deception in particular it is sort of an awkward thing; I don't tend to spend large portions of my limited free time willingly associating with those who tend to be good and habitual liars. Strange standards to have I know. In terms of actual mechanics as a DM I typically just ask a player what their intentions are if I suspect they are trying to pull some sort of lie in character or are having trouble expressing what they are going for. It is not a good goal for players to try and outwit or surprise their DM, and a quick check with the player out of character as to what they are trying to do really helps for determining which checks to call for. That all said...while player agency is paramount, I should clarify that as a DM I don't [I]ever[/I] roll a deception check for an NPC to lie unless I hear the phrase "Can I check to see if they is lying?" Or something similar. I can and frequently do give my players false info mixed in with the truth often to hilarious consequences. But my players have all been told this we we started the game, and I carefully consider what each NPC's motivations are and what knowledge they do or do not possess. Using an example you had, if someone actually [I]did[/I] believe they saw aliens flying over town I'd just have the NPC say it, then the players are free to ask if they think he's telling the truth or not. Our table tends to interpret a good insight rolls as "You get the feeling he either genuinely believes he saw aliens or he is a hell of a good liar." I deliberately leave it open and vague for the players to interpret which answer is the one they wish to pick their character to believe. I do this consistently because when I [I]do[/I] have NPCs that are genuinely good liars it means I can actually get away with false information if a rolled deception check is good. [/QUOTE]
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