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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Azrothan" data-source="post: 6470793" data-attributes="member: 6783904">If you instead interpret "a threat" as a side in the battle, the rule is simple (it mentions sides trying to be stealthy and one side gaining surprise over the other).It also makes perfect sense, as we have the hidden attacker rule to cover all those attacks from stealth/invisibility from individuals in the battle when the rest of that side doesn't try to be stealthy or are spotted.If you go with your interpretation of "a threat" as any threat:Two sides are stealthing, each side has at least 1 monster/pc that goes undetected by the other side (say both of them rolled 20 or had a member invisible). Everyone in this battle is now surprised.The PCs being surprised by 30 goblins because of that one goblin hiding behind a tree in the back while the rest of his companions are completely visible. "Guys! GUYS! There's ANOTHER goblin in the back!" - the last words heard by the party as every other member was surprised by the fact there were actually 31 goblins they were facing.Or how about that Halfling just hiding behind a medium+ sized creature all the time - perhaps just being carried on the back/in the backpack by a strong party member so they move faster... Imagine your frustration when the 30 goblins are surprised just because that Halfling pops up and goes "AHA!" - joining the ranks of the dead that fell from the same dirty trick earlier that session: a dragon, 2 Owlbears and a lone woman that was collecting water from a stream. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" />Both interpretations are easy to use, I just think the first one makes a lot more sense. Surprise is supposed to be a great tactical advantage when you actually get to set it up, not something that is meant to be abused for every encounter.</blockquote>

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