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<blockquote data-quote="Celebrim" data-source="post: 8691220" data-attributes="member: 4937">While I agree there is a flavor line that could be crossed where it's not D&amp;D any more, I feel that line is harder to define or agree on than the mechanical line.I note however that all the things you list are added on to what is already recognizably D&amp;D and don't replace it.&nbsp; For example, if we played an all human D&amp;D game, with no magic and thus only pure martial classes, set in a pastiche of the American Old West, with cowboys and six shooters that bypassed armor and made it irrelevant at some point I'd feel, &quot;Is this D&amp;D or just a D20 Western game?&quot;&nbsp; Where as if we were playing a recognizably D&amp;D game and we met a gunslinger or a musketeer, then I'd just feel we were playing D&amp;D with supplemental firearms rules.&nbsp; I tend to have little problem with game companies presenting a buffet and saying, &quot;Take what you like.&quot;&nbsp; I will with or without their permission.&nbsp; What I tend to have problems with is when the mechanics are so deeply rooted in assumptions I don't want, that I can't dig those assumptions out of the game.&nbsp; So for example, someone said, &quot;If you are playing Heroes in Blades in the Dark, you are doing it wrong.&quot;&nbsp; Now, my daughter has more experience with Blades than I do, and I don't know that that person's opinion should be trusted, but generally speaking the idea (and others) seems to be enough baked into what I've seen of Blades that I'm just not super interested.&nbsp; I don't mind playing villains and have done it before and enjoyed it, but I would prefer a system generic enough that I can play the game I want to play with it, not just the game I'm intended to play.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Celebrim, post: 8691220, member: 4937"] While I agree there is a flavor line that could be crossed where it's not D&D any more, I feel that line is harder to define or agree on than the mechanical line. I note however that all the things you list are added on to what is already recognizably D&D and don't replace it. For example, if we played an all human D&D game, with no magic and thus only pure martial classes, set in a pastiche of the American Old West, with cowboys and six shooters that bypassed armor and made it irrelevant at some point I'd feel, "Is this D&D or just a D20 Western game?" Where as if we were playing a recognizably D&D game and we met a gunslinger or a musketeer, then I'd just feel we were playing D&D with supplemental firearms rules. I tend to have little problem with game companies presenting a buffet and saying, "Take what you like." I will with or without their permission. What I tend to have problems with is when the mechanics are so deeply rooted in assumptions I don't want, that I can't dig those assumptions out of the game. So for example, someone said, "If you are playing Heroes in Blades in the Dark, you are doing it wrong." Now, my daughter has more experience with Blades than I do, and I don't know that that person's opinion should be trusted, but generally speaking the idea (and others) seems to be enough baked into what I've seen of Blades that I'm just not super interested. I don't mind playing villains and have done it before and enjoyed it, but I would prefer a system generic enough that I can play the game I want to play with it, not just the game I'm intended to play. [/QUOTE]

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