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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Helldritch" data-source="post: 8586704" data-attributes="member: 6855114">But this is where magical items for martial characters was an equalizer. The low hp of magic user made them highly susceptible to death by a fighter coming in with a potion of haste, flying or whatever. If you used "segments" then a magic user in hand to hand was effectively doomed! Need 18.00 strength? Gauntlets of ogres power, A long sword +5, double spec meant that you could mow down a magic user in just about 1 round. The average 20th level wizard without CN bonus had about 37 hp. If all three attacks of the fighter hit, just the bonuses to damage would kill the magic user. The quadratic power of martial characters were coming from the magical items they could muster.High level thieves were far from useless. The back stab could kill the magic user in one stroke, and since the hide in shadow was not a magical ability, it meant that the damn thieves would not be stopped by magical means of detecting invisibility. This is why a magic user would have guards. Just to protect himself from the damn lurkers in the shadows. And the power curve did not stopped at 10th level, only the HD improvements. Saves were way better and the fighter gained a lot of these at high level. THACO (or attack matrices) kept improving.</blockquote>