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Message: <blockquote data-quote="takyris" data-source="post: 2431635" data-attributes="member: 5171">Masada, not to pick on you, but why?If your group wanted to play scared/dysfunctional, they'd probably be playing scared/dysfunctional. I'm not saying that it isn't a valid gaming style, but it doesn't seem to be what your group wants, based on what you've just written.A viable solution, if you want more scared and they're giving you Hellboy, is to talk with them out of game or run a one-shot with PCs you've generated, letting them know that a) their PCs are everymen, not superheroes, and b) you'll be having them roll Will saves to avoid becoming Shaken or Panicked at various points in the game. (That's what I did with a change-of-pace one-shot. Made 6th-level characters, many of whom weren't much good in a fight. A 6th-level hero with a BAB of +2 and 23 hit points is not going to stand near those zombies for long... but with her Will save of +6, she'll be much cooler under stress (if I call for DC15 Will saves against Fear, for example) than the gun-toting badass with the Will save of +1.)For me, after trying faithfully to make horror stuff and having my players joke about tentacles and Cthulhu stuff even while their characters were being killed, I got the message that my players really didn't do horror.And Cthulhu has sort of passed the point of horror and gone fully into camp, from what I've seen. If I really want to scare people, I make my own monsters and avoid conspicuous tentacles -- and in fact, don't let anyone see the thing until it's killing them.Agree there. After running my big D&D campaign, I wanted to switch to d20 Modern. I ran two one-shots -- the horror one I mentioned above, with Will saves and low-combat-utility PCs, and an all-combat free-for-all to show people how fast and ugly combat could be with the Massive Damage Threshold. After seeing his 10th-level guy killed on the first round by high damage and a low save, at least one player was all over the "seek cover and run away from big stuff" mentality in other d20 Modern games.Totally agree in the average game. Given how rarely the Will save comes up in non-magic-using games, I think simply adding a DC15 Will save in stressful situations (modified as the GM feels appropriate) to avoid becoming shaken for 2d6 rounds, or to avoid becoming panicked if already shaken, goes a long way -- and makes the Smart and Dedicated heroes a bit more relevant, even if they aren't doing tons of damage. It also makes the Daredevil class a bit more useful than "guy who boosts his ability scores", which is the only reason my players take it right now. (Re: saves: I usually go with "if you get 15+, you're fine, if you get 10-14, you're shaken, if you get 9 or below, you're panicked", and as a quick and dirty solution, it works well.)</blockquote>

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