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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Celebrim" data-source="post: 5181464" data-attributes="member: 4937">I guess it depends on who you are and how you play.  They have never been important to my D&D.  I'm quite happy with stick with Dungeons and Dragons.  If I want humanoid villains, I'll likely use actual humans, or Lovecraftian 'Far Realms' stuff, or undead, or what not.  Plenty of monsters out there.I find demons problimatic at two levels.  First, since D&D from the beginning went heavily into crypto-Christian, Christian inspired occultism for its inspiration, it just cuts too near to many peoples real world beliefs.  Secondly, the entire concept to me risks deprotagonizing the game world and everything in it.  If demons, why not angels?  Why are demons priviledged to directly intervene and wage war if the forces of good are not?  Surely the forces of CG are no easier to control than the forces of CE?  Why only invasions from the Abyss?  Why don't you encounter celestials as often as infernals?  And if the servants of the gods, then why not the gods themselves?  And if that, why are living humans particularly important, since the upper and lower planes could presumably sweep away mortal forces without much of a thought?  The answers in my opinion are primarily gamist.  So what I basically suggest is for the most part, living mortals are on their own.  Whether you ar good or evil, you can't expect consistant support from the outer planes except where it has been strictly defined (as per spells, for example).  If you want to take over the world and bathe it in blood, you got to do it yourself.  Likewise, if you want to save the world, for the most part you are the one that will have to do the rescuing.  In theory, something analogous to demons is out there serving the evil deities, but if I did use them at some point, then I'd want to create some unique cosmology for them rather than stating out essentially the contents of some real world occult book.  In the mean time games are therefore more in the Tracy Hickman mold - genies, gothic horror, dragons, wierd stuff, etc.</blockquote>

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