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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Neonchameleon" data-source="post: 8354211" data-attributes="member: 87792">And many of those objections are nitpicking and trying to break a single sentence out of a whole.First, there are more than 50 NWPs in the 2e PHB and the number expands a lot as you go deeper into the various supplements. Second I'm thinking of things likeDirection Sense: A character with this proficiency has an innate sense of direction. By concentrating for 1d6 rounds, the character can try to determine the direction the party is headed. If the check fails but is less than 20, the character errs by 90 degrees. If a 20 is rolled, the direction chosen is exactly opposite the true heading. (The DM rolls the check.) Furthermore, when traveling in the wilderness, a character with direction sense has the chance of becoming lost reduced by 5%It's that sort of finicky subsystem that you're trying to claim is even vaguely like the 5e skill system.Weapon proficiencies are not NWPs. Apples to oranges.And you got very very few of them and they were intended for entire skills.The way 4e was different here was that 4e dropped any approximation of BAB. Or the different class based attack matrices or THAC0. 5e follows in 4e's footsteps here, completely breaking from the past.Casters get ability mod to attacks and damage when using weapons. It might be lower (it might not). As I say the spell system isn't the same.Indeed. It's common to 3.X and 4e - and the way attacks are rolled is 4e but not 3.X. 2e doesn't get either. The system as a whole is far closer to 4e than anything else but it shares that part with 5e.Maybe you've house ruled that out, but the actual rules as presented in the PHB p15 says "Alternatively, you can use the fixed value shown in your class entry, which is the average result of the hit die roll (rounded up)". Core rules. And it more or less in my experience drives out the rolling because the average is higher so neither min-maxers nor the risk averse do it; you can't screw over your character by the roll of a 1. And DMs also prefer it because there's no roll that needs watching more carefully. So you only roll if you either make a house rule that you must roll, you make it a house rule that you can roll then choose, or if you want to risk nerfing yourself.And healing word is the one normally used. 4e had standard action healing abilities as well.First, 4e had class groups in two directions. 5e doesn't.Second it's far closer to 4e than any other version.Nope. You're the one spinning and nitpicking.WotC introduced, with almost no backing in 3.X that sorcerers were descended from dragons. The idea there's any other type of sorcerer such as wild or storm is pure 4eAgain you're twisting and spinning in an attempt to deny the simple truth that the way 5e does things is basically 4e lite and has very little to do with 2e.Yes, anyone could climb walls. Thieves got thief skills that they allocated points to and were given percentages for. Using pocket picking as another example I'm not sure anyone could pick pockets in 2e. In 3.X picking a pocket as a swift action took -20 to the check. In 4e it was a utility power for the rogue. The way classes get to go above and beyond the skill system is turning the 4e utility powers into natural language - and has little to do with 2e.Indeed. It's 4e lite.Like goblins? Or <a href="https://roll20.net/compendium/dnd5e/Orc#content" target="_blank">orcs</a>?Oh, and 3.X had it's supernatural and spell like abilities - a very different approach.OK. Let's reality check this assertion of yours. A <a href="https://roll20.net/compendium/dnd5e/Ogre#content" target="_blank">5e ogre</a> is CR2 and has 59 hit points. That should be a balanced encounter for a party of four second level characters. Which four characters do you think at second level (and remember this isn't a hard fight) are doing an average of 15hp per hit? For that matter we can use four CR 1/2 <a href="https://roll20.net/compendium/dnd5e/Orc#content" target="_blank">orcs</a> instead - each of which has 15hp. And this time we're going to have to do not so much an average of 15hp - but hits above 15hp waste their damage.5e has a significant amount of hit point bloat. It is IMO a serious flaw with the edition, especially as it has nowhere near the tactical level of 4e.Which combat spells are rituals? Rituals were, as far as I know, introduced in 4e and 5e rituals are at least closer to 4e rituals than they are anything in any other edition.</blockquote>

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