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How is 5E like 4E?
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<blockquote data-quote="Neonchameleon" data-source="post: 8364340" data-attributes="member: 87792"><p>My point? 5e has moved the realm where competence exists out of the actual rules and into a realm of pure imagination you claim exists that is not actually supported by the rules as published by WotC.</p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">When I look at monsters (as shown) the abilities that use PC skill DCs have them fixed. A level 1 and a level 20 wizard have exactly the same DC for escaping from a grab or engulf by e.g. a gelatinous cube.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">When I look at traps whether in the DMG or the complex traps of Xanathar's the DCs to spot, avoid, and disarm remain the same and a level 20 wizard untrained in perception is <em>exactly</em> as likely to bimble into the same uncovered pit trap they did at level 1 at level 20.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">When I look at adventures there are set DCs in the adventure - so if it's not one of your areas of focus you get no better at it.</li> </ul><p>5e has indeed moved where "assumed competence" exists. They've moved it into the "things left behind with 4e" file.</p><p></p><p>And you're arguing two contradictory things about 5e:</p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">A monster (and for that matter a trap) has a flat DC because it is a functional object in the world independent of the player characters</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">The player characters improve by lowering the DCs they require.</li> </ul><p>These can not <em>both at the same time</em> be true. </p><p></p><p>Meanwhile the 4e situation is that a level 1 fighter needs a 10 to hit a goblin and a level 10 fighter needs a 10 to hit a giant. I guess the whole of pre-5e D&D got this wrong and the 5e bullet sponge enemies are the best?</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Neonchameleon, post: 8364340, member: 87792"] My point? 5e has moved the realm where competence exists out of the actual rules and into a realm of pure imagination you claim exists that is not actually supported by the rules as published by WotC. [LIST] [*]When I look at monsters (as shown) the abilities that use PC skill DCs have them fixed. A level 1 and a level 20 wizard have exactly the same DC for escaping from a grab or engulf by e.g. a gelatinous cube. [*]When I look at traps whether in the DMG or the complex traps of Xanathar's the DCs to spot, avoid, and disarm remain the same and a level 20 wizard untrained in perception is [I]exactly[/I] as likely to bimble into the same uncovered pit trap they did at level 1 at level 20. [*]When I look at adventures there are set DCs in the adventure - so if it's not one of your areas of focus you get no better at it. [/LIST] 5e has indeed moved where "assumed competence" exists. They've moved it into the "things left behind with 4e" file. And you're arguing two contradictory things about 5e: [LIST] [*]A monster (and for that matter a trap) has a flat DC because it is a functional object in the world independent of the player characters [*]The player characters improve by lowering the DCs they require. [/LIST] These can not [I]both at the same time[/I] be true. Meanwhile the 4e situation is that a level 1 fighter needs a 10 to hit a goblin and a level 10 fighter needs a 10 to hit a giant. I guess the whole of pre-5e D&D got this wrong and the 5e bullet sponge enemies are the best? [/QUOTE]
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