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<blockquote data-quote="Eldritch_Lord" data-source="post: 5894513" data-attributes="member: 52073">Two points.&nbsp; First, the druid has been pantheistic in D&amp;D since 1e.&nbsp; Take a look at the 1e druid writeup:They don't worship gods of nature primarily, but rather nature itself.&nbsp; They don't have the alignment-focused abilities of the cleric (not even turning undead), they don't anthropomorphize their &quot;gods,&quot; and they don't have the social duties of polytheistic/henotheistic clerics.Second, I didn't say the druid shouldn't be its own class--in 2e, cleric and druid are both subclasses under the Priest class grouping, and the cleric and druid have been on even footing as &quot;real classes&quot; since then.&nbsp; I don't think, however, that we need a &quot;primal&quot; power source in addition to the divine one; that was part of my point, that polytheism and pantheism can easily fall under the same source.You can certainly stick the ranger, druid, barbarian, and warden under the Primal source.&nbsp; But then, why not have a Shadow source for assassins and hexblades and illusionists, and a <s>Asian</s> Chi source for monks and samurai and ninjas, and other sources for more niche classes?&nbsp; Primal is simply a more specific Divine, just as Shadow is a more specific Arcane and Chi (which I'm quite thankful never made it into 4e as planned) is a more specific Martial.&nbsp; There is no need to give the druid a privileged position next to the fighter, wizard, rogue, and cleric.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Eldritch_Lord, post: 5894513, member: 52073"] Two points. First, the druid has been pantheistic in D&D since 1e. Take a look at the 1e druid writeup: They don't worship gods of nature primarily, but rather nature itself. They don't have the alignment-focused abilities of the cleric (not even turning undead), they don't anthropomorphize their "gods," and they don't have the social duties of polytheistic/henotheistic clerics. Second, I didn't say the druid shouldn't be its own class--in 2e, cleric and druid are both subclasses under the Priest class grouping, and the cleric and druid have been on even footing as "real classes" since then. I don't think, however, that we need a "primal" power source in addition to the divine one; that was part of my point, that polytheism and pantheism can easily fall under the same source. You can certainly stick the ranger, druid, barbarian, and warden under the Primal source. But then, why not have a Shadow source for assassins and hexblades and illusionists, and a [s]Asian[/s] Chi source for monks and samurai and ninjas, and other sources for more niche classes? Primal is simply a more specific Divine, just as Shadow is a more specific Arcane and Chi (which I'm quite thankful never made it into 4e as planned) is a more specific Martial. There is no need to give the druid a privileged position next to the fighter, wizard, rogue, and cleric. [/QUOTE]

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