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<blockquote data-quote="pemerton" data-source="post: 6289931" data-attributes="member: 42582">Just to be clear: I'm not saying that the player doesn't know the PC's hit points remaining. I'm saying that the PC doesn't know, because s/he can't, because it's not an ingame quantity. (Contrast, say, the number of coins in the character's purse, which is an ingame quantity knowable to the PC.)For me, the issue is that as a player I know when my PC's luck is going to run out and his/her skill fail; but as a character, how could I know that?&nbsp;[MENTION=4937]Celebrim[/MENTION] gives one possible explanation - &quot;I'm bleeding from a half dozen minor wounds, I've got blood leaking into my eyes, my muscles are burning, I'm light headed from blood loss, my knee is feeling about 85%, I know I'm going to lift my leather jerkin off tonight and find my torso a mass of purple wounds&quot;. For me this doesn't fully work, though, to bridge the gap between player and character knowledge, firstly because no other aspect of my character's performance is impeded (despite my knee being 85% I can still run and jump at full power, for instance), and secondly because in other situations I've been feeling pretty bad too yet triumphed.Inevitably, there is for me a gap between the player knowledge of hp remaining and the PC's knowledge.(On the metagaming discussion, I expect the players to play the game having regard to their knowledge of their hp remaining, even though the characters don't have the same knowledge. Conan doesn't know he's the protagonist, but I expect Conan's player to take up the game from a position of protagonism.)</blockquote>

[QUOTE="pemerton, post: 6289931, member: 42582"] Just to be clear: I'm not saying that the [I]player[/I] doesn't know the PC's hit points remaining. I'm saying that the PC doesn't know, because s/he can't, because it's not an ingame quantity. (Contrast, say, the number of coins in the character's purse, which is an ingame quantity knowable to the PC.) For me, the issue is that as a player I know when my PC's luck is going to run out and his/her skill fail; but as a character, how could I know that? [MENTION=4937]Celebrim[/MENTION] gives one possible explanation - "I'm bleeding from a half dozen minor wounds, I've got blood leaking into my eyes, my muscles are burning, I'm light headed from blood loss, my knee is feeling about 85%, I know I'm going to lift my leather jerkin off tonight and find my torso a mass of purple wounds". For me this doesn't fully work, though, to bridge the gap between player and character knowledge, firstly because no other aspect of my character's performance is impeded (despite my knee being 85% I can still run and jump at full power, for instance), and secondly because in other situations I've been feeling pretty bad too yet triumphed. Inevitably, there is for me a gap between the player knowledge of hp remaining and the PC's knowledge. (On the metagaming discussion, I expect the players to play the game having regard to their knowledge of their hp remaining, even though the characters don't have the same knowledge. Conan doesn't know he's the protagonist, but I expect Conan's player to take up the game from a position of protagonism.) [/QUOTE]

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