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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Pentegarn" data-source="post: 6360593" data-attributes="member: 100714">I both played in and DM'd many campaigns that started between 1st-3rd level and made it to 20th+.  Of course this was in 1st/2nd edition AD&D.  I started 3rd edition around 2001 or so.  Played through it, 3.5, Pathfinder, 4e, then back to Pathfinder.  Through all that time I never had a campaign finish, let alone reach 20th.  Between rule bloat and dependency on the battle grid coded into those rule systems, battles took forever.  Any time we got into a dungeon, we'd have many nights where campaign progress amounted to exploring a couple of rooms or making it from one end of the hall to the other.  Eventually, everyone would reach that point where they just didn't feel like putting up with it any longer.  We'd quit for awhile, then we'd return and it'd end up the same.Went back to 2nd edition, then tried a couple of other systems like LL, OSRIC, and the like.  We settled on DCC, but did some house ruling and combined it with LL.  Kept DCC's flatter math, but raised level from 10 to 20. Anyway, back on topic, one of my group is 17th level now.  And one of my online groups just hit 14th.The only reason I stuck with 3e/Pathfinder so long was because my AD&D material was destroyed by water damage in 2003.  I tried some heavy house ruling to remove the battle grid from 3e/Pathfinder.  It helped, but the game was still too bloated.  Turned to 4e out of desperation.  Just couldn't bear the thought of having to rebuild my AD&D collection again from scratch.  But 4e was a nightmare.  Since we went back to AD&D and on to what we are playing now, I and several of my players have remarked many times, when the topic came up, about how much we regret all the time wasted on the other editions.  Our campaigns, and the combat and role play in them, just flow now.</blockquote>

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