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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Dremen" data-source="post: 472369" data-attributes="member: 6773">My favorite subject.The effectiveness of any martial art is going to be based upon 2 things. 1: YOU. You must train to fight, get into shape and become dedicated. You must also find the art that fits you. Your personality, body style, level of physical fitness, philosophy etc. 2: Your instructor. You have to find an instructor who knows the applications to the moves, who is dedicated to his choosen art/s and can impart his knowlege effectively, and you have to actually attend classes. You can learn from books but don't expect to bet your life on them. You need real instruction and feedback from somebody who knows what they are doing. Books CAN help when there is no other instruction.I have studied Modified Wing Chun, wrestling, tatsudo karate, shokutan karate, Shaolin Northern and Southern styles, and traditional wing chun. I am currently studing Ba Qua. I have studied for over 12 years. Some with only books some with nothing but my self. I have finally found a good teacher (lots of bad instructors teach you how to spot this!)I was a good wrestler and kinda default into this as I am most comfortable with it.  I know this best and have the most training in it. If I fight I tend to use this.Unless you train 7 days a week, hard, it will take years to be an effective martial artist. Some styles are more efficient than others, Some have shorter learning curves. For example: Wing Chun was created later in the development of Chinese Martial arts to over come the long learning curve of other Shaolin arts.  Not to say this is the best art. It is not the best art for ME it might be for YOU. If you train like most of us 1-3 times a week or less it will take years to become effective with a good teacher. In most non-McDojo's it would take 3-10 years depending on style, dedication, instructor, student, time, class size etc.Taking a few classes willnot make you a fighter. In my experience no one style is BETTER than another. They are different. Many schools teach SPORT fighting not STREET fighting. On the street there are no rules. If you train for sport you try to score points. If you train for COMBAT you train for survival. 2 very different things. Not to say a sport fighter could not defend them selves, but they would be at a disadvantage. This I think is the biggest contributor to "MY style is better than YOURS", and why many street fighters and boxers think poorly of eastern martial arts.  Also a recreational fighter or an arm chair fighter tend not be be in the kind of physical condition these guys are in.In martial arts it also depends upon what you want. In my youth I wanted to kick some but. Now I do it for meditation, but kicking is a secondary concern. I do it for the sake of the art. Ba Qua is what fits me. My wife can't stand it. She hates grappling and soft moves. She studies Mui Tai kick boxing, and not a sport version.There is nothing wrong with training for sport but know what you are training.Also many scamers are out there. So be carefull. Bruce Lee had some good advice. Believe 1/2 of what you see and nothing of what you hear in martial arts.Also I have been told by my sifu, who is an american who has studied at the Shaolin Temple and is in the MA hall of fame, that many people; especially in the west are not given the COMPLETE art. They are given part, some applications / moves / etc. are held back from them, even in china. He said he found it difficult to find instructors that knew the real stuff. Many don't know that information was held back. This is one of the reasons Bruce Lee founded Jeet Kun Do. He is 1/4 german and as such, was not taught the complete style of Wing Chun. He was not shown the foot work. So he researched and came up with his own art.I find this credible because in early China/Japan/Korea etc. Martial arts were life and death. Secrets were only passed onto worthy students or family. If you had a secret move it was like a powerful secret weapon. Many styles were born. Some may be better than others but there are too many variables to quantify and qualify it.Anyone who trains for combat with a good knowlegable instructor, and is dedicated to thier art will be an opponent to be rekoned with. Be the style internal or external; Chinese, Indian, Japanese, Western. The dedication of the fighter in question is going to be what wins the fight.On a side note; movie fight scenes look good but if a fight takes more than 30 seconds then it took too long. These fights are designed to LOOK GOOD not show effective moves or tactics.I have a close friend who is a very good traditional wing chun instructor and he has defended himself in a bar once and it was so fast that you couldn't tell that he even touched the guy it was over before it began. Anyone looking would think the other guy tripped. It was not flashy or sexy but it got the job done.-DBTW: Martial Arts has made me what I am. It defines me. It took me 12 years of searching but when I found Ba Qua it fit. It was like falling in love. It fits my boby, mind, philosophy.  I couldn't stand Karate. Not that it wasn't effective it just wasn't me.If you want some history on chinese internal arts this site is great. It even has some quick time movies. Lots of good info. <a href="http://www.shenwu.com/" target="_blank">Internal Arts</a></blockquote>

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