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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Ovinomancer" data-source="post: 7283233" data-attributes="member: 16814">The first is timid, the second is not.  The first makes no comment on player skill, the second does.  What, exactly is your issue with the two?I'm left not sure if you're advocating for this position or saying that I'm advocating for this position.  If the latter, your complete wrongness on the matter could have been easily determined by the fact I didn't say that, another poster did.  Attributing the argument from another poster to me, when I've neither quoted or addressed it in any way, is super weird.  You should try not to do that.Further to that point is the fact that Funny Hat has chosen, for whatever erstwhile and likely good reason, to block me, so i cannot engage in any argument from Funny Hat to begin with.  A second, easily avoided, failure on your part to assume that i'm familiar with or using an argument I haven't advanced myself.If, however, you are endorsing this ridiculous definition of skill, then I'm somewhat unsurprised.  You've developed a habit of adopting very odd definitions for otherwise easily understood concepts so that your initial statements remain correct, so long as you use the now advanced strange definition.  And conflating skill with engagement is very strange, as the two are not similar at all.  This is easily exposed with the example of a neophyte player who is very outgoing and engaged but has no knowledge of how the game works (engaged, but unskilled) vice a veteran player with excellent system knowledge who happens to be shy and is now playing with a new group  (timid, but skilled) vice the player that just doesn't care to engage and would rather look at their phone (unengaged, who cares about skill?).  Wrapping timidity into skill makes the terms useless for discussion outside of the narrow application you're using, and, since those terms are not narrow ones, that's a ridiculous thing to do.Either way, the issue remains with you, and not with me.  There is no conflation between timidity and skill in any of my posts.  I reject outright that the two can be conflated.What a strange strawman.  Of course all metaphors have limits.  No one claimed otherwise.  And, of course you can have shared spotlight, but PC C isn't very much involved in this scene, having no hooks with NPC X or hooks that engage PCs A or B in this scenario, and so he's out of the spotlight.It's still zero-sum.  As above, PC C isn't getting the benefit of spotlight time because A and B are getting it -- A and B are consuming all of the spotlight (or the vast majority of it), and there isn't more created to hand out by their consumption of it.  Spotlight time is a limited, nonfungible, resource, so it must be zero-sum.  Maybe you need to brush up on what zero-sum actually means.  This is a case where it's absolutely applicable.</blockquote>

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