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Message: <blockquote data-quote="hawkeyefan" data-source="post: 9007306" data-attributes="member: 6785785">I doubt it. This is a pretty common breakdown among the PbtA games I'm familiar with. I'm not an expert by any means, but I have a good deal of familiarity with several of them. Not all of them work the same, and I've not played or read Cartel nor Thirsty Sword Lesbians, so I don't know if they deviate wildly from the overall PbtA design. My guess is that they do not. I've bolded the element that's really important here. When there's a lull, you don't just hit a character with harm. You make a softer move, signal future badness, let's say. If you do make a hard move, then it should be one more designed to force some action than to inflict harm or penalties. I just bolded the rest of this section because this is describing a situation where you've established a threat and the player does nothing about it, so you make a hard move. There's no surprise for the player here. This is a big part of my point. You don't make this kind of move unless you've already made a soft move toward it, and the player does nothing about it. Again, I bolded the whole thing because I don't think it contradicts what I said. It makes no comment on soft or hard moves, here, but it clearly dictates when you can make a move. Two of the three times are very clear and specific. The other, "when the table gets quiet" sounds very much like a when there's a lull above, so I imagine it would work the same. I don't agree at all. I think you cherry picked some tidbits that you thought made a strong case... but I don't think that they really did, since they don't clearly contradict what I was saying. They mostly support what I said. And there's so much of each book that you left out that I expect was much more in synch with what I said.... so yeah, not enough to get the point across. I think your general take on rules and how malleable they always are doesn't jibe well at all with Apocalypse World or most of the PbtA games I know. There certainly are some that run differently, so maybe your view would be more suitable for those, but I think they'd have to deviate pretty wildly to for that to be the case.</blockquote>

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