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Message: <blockquote data-quote="gizmo33" data-source="post: 2262519" data-attributes="member: 30001">Yes, I do count all of those.  The difference in the form that "taxes" take IMO is largely a matter of the availability of coin, the feasibility of enforcement, custom, etc.  Rather than keep track of all of the zillions of details, I choose to simplify by looking at the question in terms of the total value of output by a peasant, and what percentage of that is taxed (in whatever form).  Labor can always be traded for coin, etc.  And if it's not, I choose to deal with that on the macro side (ie. factor in a -10% due to inefficiency, or poor market forces, or whatever) rather than enumerate the seemingly hundreds of ways that lords had to wheedle money out of their subjects and figure out how campaign events impact each and every one.  That's not obvious to me, but I'm not 100% sure on what you're saying here.  A wealthier person will probably provide far more to the lord than the poor.  Are you saying that they'll provide less as a % of their total income?  That's not obvious to me at all.  If you factor in all of the hired help and such that wealthier persons would have - does the overall result per capita really change substantially?  Whether the 4:1 ratio represents a yeoman with 16 hired hands vs. 17 poor peasants - does that matter?   It's not clear to me that your status as a free-person would affect the amount that you pay as a %.  If I'm wealthier, for example, I can pay my 50% in money, which keeps me from having to toil in the lord's field like the serfs.  But it still doesn't mean I'm not giving 50%.  Ok, but are you sure that those details aren't obscuring a more basic, consistent economic picture?  Do the details of whether or not it's sheep or grain really impact the gold piece total that the baron has at the end of the month?  Especially in a game system where you're trying to create a model for wealth based on land-ownership.  Someone could write a 300 page book on all of the details related to plate armor, but it doesn't make for a feasible game.  So in DnD, as a result, we have AC, gp cost, movement restrictions, and a few other details.  I'm looking for a manor system that takes that approach.  So if a baron chooses to raise more sheep, then he gets an X% increase from the standard.  The problem I have with most history books (that all pretty much sound just like your quote above) is that they wave their hands about discussing the various complications without getting down to the crunch that's going to be useable.  (Although I suppose history books are not written for people playing DnD).</blockquote>

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