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Message: <blockquote data-quote="tetrasodium" data-source="post: 8181141" data-attributes="member: 93670">[USER=6987520]@6ENow![/USER] I have a player like that with math. The other benefit of just halving the hp is that the gm has more room to round things for expediency than players.If you have an encounter with several monsters, your probably going to be using weaker monsters than extreme high CR solo boss monster type creatures.  Coupled with 5e's math being tuned to assume a  hit rate somewhere north of 50-60% you wind up with a drawn out slugfest where a lot of time is wasted rolling damage for every monster &  each player(including the one who is awful at math) rather than just quickly missing about half or more of those first attacks & nearly all of the second/third/etc ones.  Having all of those attacks assumed to hit there is less headroom in the system's math for magic items.[spoiler="All the red dragons by age"]<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">5e is lacking a lot of those* with just cr4 wyrmling, cr10 young, cr17 adult & cr24 ancient.  Conveniently cr4 wyrmling matches the cr4 wyrmling , cr10 young matches the cr10 juvenile, with cr13 young red shadow & cr13 young adult being close,  & cr24 ancient matches the cr24 wyrm leaving only the cr17 adult the odd drake out falling between the cr 15 & cr18 adult/mature adult so I'll denote that in bold to avoid obfuscation & provide clarity</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Again 3.5 version | 5e version</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Wyrmling cr4 59hp 16ac  | wyrmling 75hp ac17 That gives 5e 16hp & surprisingly a point of ac</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">very young cr5 95hp 18ac  | --</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">young cr7 123hp 21ac  | --</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Juvenile cr 10 168 hp 24ac  | cr10 young red dragon 178hp 18ac  That gives 5e 10hp & drops the ac by 8</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">young adult cr13 218 hp 26ac  |  178hp 18ac  That gives  a 40 point hp drop with an 8 point ac drop.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">adult cr15 253hp 29ac  | 256hp 19ac  If you put the nearest comparison here that gives a 6 point hp jump & 10 point ac drop.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">mature adult cr18 312hp 32ac  | 256hp 19ac  If you put the nearest comparison here that gives a 56 point hp drop & an even larger 13 point ac drop.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">old cr20 378hp 33ac  |  --</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">very old cr21 449hp 36ac | --</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">ancient cr23 527hp 39ac  | --</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">wyrm cr24 610hp  42ac  | 546hp 22ac  That gives a 64 point hp drop & 20 point ac drop.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">great  wyrm cr2 660hp 41ac  | --</li> </ul>[/spoiler]4e is too different on a system level for useful comparisons & your the pretty much only one who wants to keep bringing it up. There is an extreme variety of red dragons in 3.5 but a system difference is critical to the high end.  5e's survivability & the assumed to hit result of BA is tuned to the point that the sort of ultra deadly beyond lethal encounters a 5e party  can just snooze through whike such encounters in 3.5  would be a one sided slaughter.  Those high CR dragons were plot devices with statblocks on par with literal deity statblocks & provide examples of why I'm pretty sure there was at least one magic items to control or command dragons.What you do notice is that things start to invert around cr10 where the 3.5 versions display how magic items being assumed or not plays out & why you can't just bolt them onto a system that assumes none. CR10 & up is fairly beefy tier of monster & aside from extremely high level games is probably not a great choice to use for a bunch of mooks as xge90 will confirm.  It doesn't matter if your mooks are throughout the stereotypical dungeon or fighting alongside the bbeg in the sterotypical throne room battle with the bbeg.  Those mooks with all that extra hp are going to be a slog due to hit rates where everyone is assumed to mostly hit & hp pools that are quite large in light of how much damage players & monsters dish out in any given round. Your zombie note is why I included the CR of every monster on the list.  The cr 1/2 zombies with fewer hp & higher ac than the cr 1/4 5e one are much closer in power & role a GM will use them for than the cr1 cr2 cr3 or cr4 ones & those higher cr zombies either don't exist or are split off into other more discrete creatures like the ogre zombie that 5e had an equivalent version of .  I didn't include a 3.5 creature if 5e had no clear equivalent in the mm.  There could be an equivalent to that cr1 29hp 16ac troglodyte zombie in one of the 5e books but it didn't seem to be in the 5e mm where 352 of monsters by name has [spoiler="this"][ATTACH=full]131850[/ATTACH][/spoiler]My list was made by making a list of common monsters  & then going through to find their statblocks even in the cases where a creature didn't fit the pattern like one of the giants.  I guess if you consider common monsters cherry picking then sure, but common & especially lower cr monsters are precisely the ones that will be fighting the players in notable monsters.  An extra 64hp on a cr24 monster is a bit of a rounding error for a monster that doesn't even fit on the xge90 tables for player:monster ratios by level & cr.In terms of 5e monsters feeling like giant bloated bags of hp, which monsters is an important detail. If a GM is throwing waves of adult or ancient dragons at their party it's probably because they want to kill them or is using them as an invisible wall in the world making those dragons something that certainly won't be 't considered mooks by most reasonable standards.  XgE has some useful tables on page 90 for good ratio of players to monsters by player level & CR  Above CR10  you don't even get more than one maybe two till extreme high levels. * which is fine & the reasons both systems made those choices to include or omit various specific monsters that are probably unimportant for reasons other being hard to make direct comparisons when no equivalent exists.</blockquote>

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